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Horse riders' demands delay cycling reforms

Equestrians want equal access to cycle paths - and for them to be made of soft materials

Horse riders are getting in the way of cycling reform as they demand to be included in a blueprint for cycling.

More than 1,500 equestrians have written to the Department for Transport asking that they should not be banned from cycle lanes, which will be protected by wider segregation from traffic.

They say these horse and cycle lanes should be made of softer materials, which would be better for horses’ hooves, but slow down cyclists.

They also want the Highway Code to be rewritten to drop guidance that says riders “should not take a horse on to a cycle track”, according to the Sunday Times.

The DfT is now having to respond to these requests, delaying the cycling blueprint yet further.

The British Horse Society is behind the campaign, running a template letter on its website, which has led to nearly half of the cycling blueprint consultation responses being dominated by horse riders.

The society’s letter said that “routes being developed for walking and cyclists” should be “made available for equestrian use”.

It stated that 4,052 horse riders were admitted to hospital after being injured in 2013/14 compared with 2,820 cyclists.

It added that: “It seems strange that the government does not want to achieve the same for equestrians at the same time.”

Ralph Smyth, head of infrastructure at the Campaign to Protect Rural England, said: “Investing in safer horse riding won’t increase productivity in the way safer cycling can, such as by helping people get in and out of our increasingly gridlocked market towns. But it shouldn’t be difficult to ensure all riders can benefit from giving rural areas their fair share of the nation’s resources.”

Mark Weston, director of access at the British Horse Society, said: “Equestrians desperately need safe provision for the same reasons as walkers and cyclists: many roads are no longer safe due to the speed and volume of traffic.”

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48 comments

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sodit | 7 years ago
2 likes

No no no

I do not want  horses anywhere near cycle paths or footpaths.  Having seen the damage horses do to footpaths when the riders get fedup of their animals walking through the mud exetera on the bridalways that they have cut to pieces by being used when to wet (and then lay the blame on 4x4 users with not a tyre track in site).  We would end up carrying our bikes not riding them!

Anyway when you look at the amount of greenroads right of ways and bridleways in the UK to the amount of dedicated cyclepaths as opposed to multiuse footpaths they are doing very well already thank you very much.

And as for horse shit no, no thank you.

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dare99 | 7 years ago
0 likes

Great. We can look forward to great steaming piles of horse shite on our cycle paths.

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handlebarcam | 7 years ago
2 likes

Personally, I do a 20 mile each-way commute on the back of my pet hippopotamus, Gerald. Therefore I think all bridleways should be flooded.

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davel | 7 years ago
5 likes

I don't care what it's made of: it's shit, and great mounds of it are created in each single movement. Whatever its composition, a hobby's side-effect dumping piles of it on public paths is unacceptable.

I'm sure it's great on your allotment. It's less than great on shared-use paths. It's most often dropped at gates, stiles, subways and passings, making it difficult to avoid. It gets rained on and flattens and spreads, covering the path, literally, in shit. I and others commute along these paths, when it has rained, covering us, literally, in shit. And the properties that are great for your allotment also encourage growth on the path, so it quickly doesn't resemble a path anymore.

So yeah: I'll be a bit more tolerant of your hobby that gets shit on me, when mine get shit on you.

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ianrparsons | 7 years ago
2 likes

Oh dear, so many emotive comments! I commute 100 miles weekly, AND also enjoy horse riding. I drive an ordinary car, rely on horse hire as cannot afford to own one. The main point is live and let live. Some cycle routes are suitable for sharing with equestrians, others are better for one or the other. Rather strange comments about about the mess too! Horse poo is basically partially digested grass, and relatvely odour free and certainly not like dog mess. Again I have dogs and also collect horse muck for my allotment - usually about 1/3 of a ton in bags in the back of the car. It ain't that bad! Mutual tolerance and understanding, and ignore the ignorant people who just have to be objectionable. Their loss. Car drivers though do put horses and riders at risk by passing too close and too fast so we do have a shared objective - safer leisure time.

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wycombewheeler replied to ianrparsons | 7 years ago
2 likes
ianrparsons wrote:

Oh dear, so many emotive comments! I commute 100 miles weekly, AND also enjoy horse riding. I drive an ordinary car, rely on horse hire as cannot afford to own one. The main point is live and let live. Some cycle routes are suitable for sharing with equestrians, others are better for one or the other. Rather strange comments about about the mess too! Horse poo is basically partially digested grass, and relatvely odour free and certainly not like dog mess. Again I have dogs and also collect horse muck for my allotment - usually about 1/3 of a ton in bags in the back of the car. It ain't that bad! Mutual tolerance and understanding, and ignore the ignorant people who just have to be objectionable. Their loss. Car drivers though do put horses and riders at risk by passing too close and too fast so we do have a shared objective - safer leisure time.

That'll be off comfort if I have a spill due to lack of traction. When was in bruges all the horse and carriages for tourist rides were rigged to collect the manure. Here covering the roads is acceptable.

As to drivers close passing, my experience is that it happens far more to cyclists. I have had drivers buzz me despite the oncoming lane being clear before moving right over for the horse in front. I'm sure there are some nutters who close pass horses, but far fewer than will close pass cyclists. Probably because 1) they don't want their precious car to br kicked 2) hitting a horse will mess their car up and could injure them, unlike hitting a cyclist.

Bridleways for horses cycle paths (with smooth tarmac) for cyclists. ideally both would be provided.

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FluffyKittenofT... replied to ianrparsons | 7 years ago
1 like
ianrparsons wrote:

Oh dear, so many emotive comments! I commute 100 miles weekly, AND also enjoy horse riding. I drive an ordinary car, rely on horse hire as cannot afford to own one. The main point is live and let live. Some cycle routes are suitable for sharing with equestrians, others are better for one or the other. Rather strange comments about about the mess too! Horse poo is basically partially digested grass, and relatvely odour free and certainly not like dog mess. Again I have dogs and also collect horse muck for my allotment - usually about 1/3 of a ton in bags in the back of the car. It ain't that bad! Mutual tolerance and understanding, and ignore the ignorant people who just have to be objectionable. Their loss. Car drivers though do put horses and riders at risk by passing too close and too fast so we do have a shared objective - safer leisure time.

Not actually sure about the rest of it, but can't agree on the horse dung. It might not be as much of a disease vector as dog crap (and, come to think of it, not as much of a health hazard as what cars pump out), but it still has the consistency of damp mud (with a bit of extra ick factor) and is not something it's any fun to ride into or even walk through.

I don't really see why a desire to engage in a leisure activity gives any group the right to dump tons of rubbish on other people's transport infrastructure. On first thought I'd say share the paths but only on condition you leave them exactly as you found them.

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brooksby replied to ianrparsons | 7 years ago
2 likes

ianrparsons wrote:

... so we do have a shared objective - safer leisure time.

"Leisure time " is when I (unfortunately) don't get to ride my bike. I use mine mainly to go to work or to the shops so I don't need to get the car out. Does your hired horse do that?

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wycombewheeler | 7 years ago
1 like

All new cycle lanes to be installed with additional 2m wide soft track for horses. Preferably between hr road and cycle path.
?

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gcj | 7 years ago
1 like

Presumably they'll be willing to concede priority to cyclists on designated cycle ways as cyclists are required to for horses on bridleways? I'm not so sure given some of the horsey types around here.

Not meaning to tar all horse riders with one brush of course. Most that I know are lovely and way above average in terms of consideration for other road users. Unfortunately some of them seem to have friends/fellow horse enthusiasts whose position on cyclists is "run them off the road!" and "they don't pay road tax!" (irony much?) or as one lady put it "give them the same treatment motorists give us!" (WTF?). And I can't count on two hands the number of times I've almost been clipped by Land Rovers pulling horse boxes.

I'm not sure why they'd want to share a path with bikes anyway, horses seem especially freaked out by bikes, but whatever. I'm all for supporting the rights of people to enjoy their hobby safely. Can't help but feel that a better solution is more bridleways or opening up access to footpaths. 

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FatBoyW | 7 years ago
1 like

Last few horse and riders  I rode past was actually about 40,  not sure why a hunt is still allowed? What do all the hundred or so dogs do? Never bee that close to the hounds before, really mean scary animals with blood in their eye, of course they wouldn't let them tear other animals apart would they, it's banned isn't it? The hunt hunting that is not allowed. 

Not a fan of horse riders or riding, bit like open road motorsport, arcane and a bit last century.

provide horses with closed circuits, it's seems that is what BC want for cycle racing! Only seems fair

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Shades | 7 years ago
3 likes

So what about the bridleways that are churned up by horses and un-cycleable? Can't see the horse community agreeing to have them made fit for bikes.  We've all had the icy looks when out on an MTB.

Horse riding is a leisure activity and, whilst a lot of cyclists use cycle paths for leisure as well, if we want to see a big change in attitude towards cycling then these paths have to be seen as part of the transport network ie 'getting from A to B.  Most of the time I'm on a traffic free path, I'm commuting  and pleased that I'm away from cars; I'm not on it for leisure.  Don't see many horse owners riding to work?

Chris Boardman did a piece during the Tour de France on cycling in Holland (I think).  His great line was, "I didn't see cyclists; I just saw people in normal clothes riding bikes".  If motorists think they should just have to tolerate us at weekends in the summer (ie leisure) and we should clear off the rest of the time, then we'll get nowhere.

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MoutonDeMontagne | 7 years ago
1 like

Looks like Gravel Bikes are going to be everywhere soon then!

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Yorkshire wallet | 7 years ago
4 likes

Horse riders seem to be an ungrateful bunch anyway. Last time I passed a couple I made an effort to shout a 'hello' ahead, rather than 'excuse me' or 'coming through' or something that could be taken as unfriendly or whatever. All I got was a passive aggressive telling off "don't go down through your gears passing a horse".

Go fuck yourselves then!!! It's a sad say when I've got to upgrade my drivetrain as not to upset a horse with clunky changes.

 

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PaulBox | 7 years ago
0 likes

Oooh, an excuse yo buy a gravel bike...

 

https://www.evanscycles.com/cannondale-slate-105-2017-adventure-road-bik...

 

 

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surly_by_name | 7 years ago
6 likes

I don't think we should discriminate against horses. Accordingly, I think it only fair that any horse riding a bicycle shoudl be free to use cycle paths.

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bikebot replied to surly_by_name | 7 years ago
14 likes

surly_by_name wrote:

I don't think we should discriminate against horses. Accordingly, I think it only fair that any horse riding a bicycle shoudl be free to use cycle paths.

//67.media.tumblr.com/tumblr_lo1kgiGn4m1qly8keo1_250.gif)

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ianrobo | 7 years ago
2 likes

so just a query when the horses dump their waste products all over the roads where I live do these riders pick it up ?

I think the answer proves who needs to sort themselves out first.

As a responsbile dog owner I off course always take a poo bag with me ! 

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tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
3 likes

Not even sure I find horse riding ethical. Definitely believe horse racing is unethcial. The death toll is too high for me to stomach.

 

http://www.horsedeathwatch.com

 

Definitely don't feel like horse riders and cyclists are some sort of in-it-together family. Cycling is an efficient, clean mode of transport. Also a way of keeping fit and reducing the NHS burden. Don't buy that we have to like them because they're 'not cars'.

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Mungecrundle replied to tritecommentbot | 7 years ago
1 like

unconstituted wrote:

...

Definitely don't feel like horse riders and cyclists are some sort of in-it-together family. Cycling is an efficient, clean mode of transport. Also a way of keeping fit and reducing the NHS burden. Don't buy that we have to like them because they're 'not cars'.

 

 

Maybe it's that people like horses more than they like cyclists ( I await a legal opinion on that comparison). Maybe it's because a horse will really wreck your car if you drive into one. But I'm always happy to see them out on a Sunday morning, on the local backroads acting as mobile chicanes and reminding drivers that there is a reason not to hoon round blind corners, because you might just get unlucky and hit a cyclist (me) or you could get real unlucky and hit a horse. You won't get much sympathy or understanding from anyone for doing that.

 

As for bridleways and byeways; horse riders, cyclists and ramblers may have differences, but fundamentally we all want more and better maintained access to the countryside.

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Yorkshire wallet | 7 years ago
4 likes

What percentage of cycle path users are using a horse? It's so small their argument should be instantly dismissed. The horse is not a means of transport for the working masses, elitism has it's downfalls as well. Now stick to moaning at MTB riders on bridleways and being a danger to all and sundry when your horse gets out of control.

Sadly because the average horser is also a moneybag, they have enough money and time to devote to their cause through silly legal challenges.

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Jackson replied to Yorkshire wallet | 7 years ago
5 likes
Yorkshire wallet wrote:

What percentage of cycle path users are using a horse? It's so small their argument should be instantly dismissed. The horse is not a means of transport for the working masses, elitism has it's downfalls as well. Now stick to moaning at MTB riders on bridleways and being a danger to all and sundry when your horse gets out of control.

Sadly because the average horser is also a moneybag, they have enough money and time to devote to their cause through silly legal challenges.

My thoughts exactly. Horse riders are cash- and time-rich, making an animal carry them around for something to do. If they're trying to get somewhere they can take the Porsche or Land Rover. Skint people like me are on a bike trying to get to work in a cheap and environmentally friendly manner, which I also manage to achieve without s***ting everywhere (most days).

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oldmixte | 7 years ago
1 like

Horse riding should be banned. Note the number of times the air ambulance programmes show them attending horse riders, it's obviously a dangerous activity and a drain on the NHS.

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atlaz | 7 years ago
3 likes

Does anyone know what the problem is with the UK that arguments like this occur. On the continent it may not be perfect but there's plentiful cycle routes mostly logical and in good condition, horse-ists seem to have plenty of riding opportunities and drivers, for the most part, are tolerant of other road users. Contrasting with the UK, what's the big difference that makes Brits so confrontational.

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Ramz | 7 years ago
3 likes

I noticed in the Netherlands they have seperate automobile roads, bicycle roads (paved), bridleways (unpaved) and pedestrian paths (some paved and some unpaved). It works well and leads to absence of conflict between different types of users. Horse riders don't actually want to mix with other road users, and neither do cyclists. The problem occurs when we only cater for one type of road user (automobile driver). Let's just cut out all the angst and arguing and do what works? The attached photo shows a paved rural cycle road near Amsterdam, with a soft bridlepath on one side and a soft pedestrian path on the other.

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alexb replied to Ramz | 7 years ago
1 like

Ramz wrote:

I noticed in the Netherlands they have seperate automobile roads, bicycle roads (paved), bridleways (unpaved) and pedestrian paths (some paved and some unpaved). It works well and leads to absence of conflict between different types of users. Horse riders don't actually want to mix with other road users, and neither do cyclists. The problem occurs when we only cater for one type of road user (automobile driver). Let's just cut out all the angst and arguing and do what works? The attached photo shows a paved rural cycle road near Amsterdam, with a soft bridlepath on one side and a soft pedestrian path on the other.

I was going to chip in with exactly this.

The problem is that the council ends up being handed the bill for building both sets of paths.

However, the BHS is quite correct there needs to be provision designed to meet the needs of many of the more vulnerable road users who would in many cases prefer not to be on the roads.

The numbers of riders killed and injured is a bit of a red herring as very few of those injuries/deaths take place on the road.

 

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pakennedy | 7 years ago
6 likes

Why on earth do horse riders want to share with bikes? I always slow right down when passing a horse and call out but I can guarantee a sizable proportion won't.

Horses really don't like being suddenly passed by a near silent machine that's doing 15mph.

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awjr | 7 years ago
10 likes

As somebody who has a daughter who rides horses, the reason they want 'soft' paths is that it allows them to gallop. Galloping is fun. Riding on roads you need to take it slow and have your horse shoed.

What soft paths do do is exclude people with disabilities who find soft paths a nightmare if you are in wheelchair and change a route from being usable all year round into one that is only used after a dry period. 

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JonD replied to awjr | 7 years ago
0 likes

awjr wrote:

As somebody who has a daughter who rides horses, the reason they want 'soft' paths is that it allows them to gallop. Galloping is fun. Riding on roads you need to take it slow and have your horse shoed.

What soft paths do do is exclude people with disabilities who find soft paths a nightmare if you are in wheelchair and change a route from being usable all year round into one that is only used after a dry period. 

 

Is it my imagination or do galloping horses cause more surface 'movement' ie dug-up surface than at walking speed ?

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awjr replied to JonD | 7 years ago
1 like

JonD wrote:

 

Is it my imagination or do galloping horses cause more surface 'movement' ie dug-up surface than at walking speed ?

Yes a shoed horse can only get traction through digging it's hooves into the surface. Hence you can follow a group of horses trotting/walking along and see little damage, but a horse that is galloping will be gouging out the dirt surface and throwing dirt everywhere. 

One of the reason you see jockeys covered in mud after a race. 

Gallopping on a hard surface can be extremely dangerous for the horse.

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