London taxi drivers claim film shows most cyclist jump red lights - but does it?

Interesting, the first 2 cycles, 1 cyclist jumps each time. When 1 or 2 others are stopped already. Then a stream come through indicating that a group may have been stopped just off camera. In both instances a white van encroaches the ASL, and a motorbike does the same in the second cycle also. Anyone can find fault if looking at this video

I actually found the video more enjoyable then Waterworld starring Kevin Costner...

As a cyclist I am totally in favour of everyone obeying the law. I therefore look forward to the LTDA agreeing to all their members having GPS trackers fitted to ensure compliance of their members.

Red light jumpers should get at least 3 points on their driving license and/or a hefty fine, irrespective of the type of vehicle being driven. Bus, lorry, car, motorcycle or bicycle .... you go through a red light you put pedestrians crossing at risk (i don't care about you if you don't care about anyone else).

Worst of all you contribute to a free for all culture where everyone feels that they can break the law if they judge it to be safe/convenient. The problem being that not every person's judgement is sound.

Don't turn a blind eye to red light jumping cyclists and then complain about the driver who goes through a red light and wipes out a cyclist or a pedestrian. He probably isn't a psycho. He probably judged it safe to go through too.

So we are shocked that a London Cabbie has a one-eyed biased view of something they don't like??? Have you never been in a cab? They're all intollerant borderline racist bigots*

*isn't it easy to make wide sweeping sterotyping statements...

IMO too many cyclists jump red lights, i'm not sure there are many people who would argue that point. In some circumstances it can be argued that it is safer to do so, but arguing, as the article does, that they aren't doing anything that dangerous is not helpful. It isn't only about safety, just because something isn't all that dangerous doesn't mean you should ignore the law and do what you want. It is that approach that seems to annoy motorists the most, and i can't say i disagree. If there is no safety reason to keep going, then f**king stop.

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We either obey the law, or else we stop whingeing when others don't obey it.

"The law" is an ass. It's actually statistically the law-abiding cyclists more likely to end up under a truck - they've gone where the infrastructure has guided them (up the left to the ASL), stopped at the red light...and then been crushed by a left turning truck.

Other countries have a "turn right on red" law (obviously it would be "left" in the UK) which is safer and more convenient for all road users so why not here?
Most riders are not "breaking the law" in the black/white definition you have. They're bending it for their own safety. "Anticipating" the lights by a few seconds (yes, technically it's jumping them but it gets the rider away from the F1 starting grid of taxis, buses etc behind them).

A bike can quite easily filter into traffic without causing anyone any harm (unlike a car which takes up 10sq metres of road space). So it makes sense that "the law" gets rewritten to take that into account. When I'm cycling on a road, my safety comes first, the safety and convenience of other road users (pedestrian, horse riders, motorists) comes second and the law comes a distant third.

Down with this sort of thing!

in the first 1:30, which is about all i'm willing to give to this sh1t, there are two cars running reds (not counting the going very late on a yellow) and at the very least 4 pedestrians crossing without the green man. I think we should all just stay off the streets because obviously no one is to be trusted...

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How on earth did the LTDA manage to get the Evening Standard to run this heavily edited video as a main story?

I posted something about this the other day on another thread - basically the media (and the readers) can't cope with anything as complicated as "data" - journalists aren't paid to understand any of the stories they're covering, they're paid to make good headlines. So they'll find an article - might be quite long and involved - and condense it to fit their angle, their criteria and their readership.

So a medical journal reporting on some new drug trials ends up being reported in the Daily Express as "NEW WONDER DRUG WILL CURE CANCER!!" whereas what the report actually says is that early indications are that cancer tumours in mice show signs of reduction when given [new drug].

Same here. Show a 10 second clip, claim that all cyclists jump reds and there you go, cue a whole peloton of cyclists bashing away furiously on the comments page to defend themselves and a whole load of other newsboard commentators claiming that they're "nearly killed" on a daily basis by cyclists and we should all pay road tax. Bumps up the newspapers click-rate on the website.

Noting a majority of the cars stopping after the first white line in the cycle safe zone that is clearly...sorry poorly marked up.
Like JonSP states "Meanwhile, it my experience that most taxi drivers routinely flout speed limits"
Like the taxi driver who got four speeding tickets on the same street in one afternoon going through clearly identified average speed cameras in Plymouth a while ago.

How on earth did the LTDA manage to get the Evening Standard to run this heavily edited video as a main story?

Note that not a single cyclist (that I saw) jumps the light from the other junction.

Equally, a lot of the cyclists I saw in the video stopped, waiting for peds to cross, and then started up a few seconds before the lights went to green, i.e. getting a head start and clearing the junction

Which makes some sense when you see some of the dodgy undertaking by drivers who swerve into the cyclists, when they are slowed down by a right turning vehicles.

Btw, good rebuttal here:
http://aseasyasridingabike.wordpress.com/2013/11/28/response-to-ltda-ana...

It would be intresting to see what would happen if all cyclist didnt jump lights but did ride in the primary position.

I am very disappointed with the fact that, statistically, focussing on TWO junctions is NOT proof of an RLJ cyclist percentage. I had a discussion with a friend at work (he cycles in occasionally from North London) and he claims that a large percentage of cyclists jump red lights, BUT on my commute from Paddington the vast majority of cyclists do NOT jump red lights. Clearly, and this should not come as a shock to anybody, there are differences in road layouts, traffic volumes etc. I have no personal experience of the junctions involved in the Taxi Driver "survey", so will not comment on specifics. Almost anyone could pick a junction and monitor it for their own devices.
What I will say, however, is that I always try to accommodate taxis, letting them turn first at traffic lights as they are invariably quicker than me and often wave them on. Unfortunately, I do not get much in the way of appreciation from most taxi drivers. The one who blatantly went through red whilst cyclists, cars and motorbikes had stopped, earlier this week around Buckingham Palace, should be brought to book - he was darned fortunate no pedestrian was actually crossing at the time.
One more small request for taxis - please do NOT drive along in the dark with sidelights - in urban environments, they end up looking like extensions of the shops, street lamps etc.
One more thing ... last night I stopped at a zebra crossing to let pedestrians cross, as usual, when a coach undertook me with pedestrians ON the zebra crossing ...
Have a nice weekend, everyone

The video shows the behavior of most cyclist nearing a red light that doesn't really guard a crossing, as with going right on a crossing with a red light in some cases is allowed (in Holland that's left), it should be allowed here also.
Although i second that the perceived behaviour on the video is more or less correct, on a real crossing cyclist would be more carfull when jumping.
(the perception of a cyslist seeing a red light as a sign to be aware of traffic rather then stopping is correct, but in Holland it hardly leads to trouble, but i get it that car drivers will be jealous and would want to jump red lights too - guess this is what the world looks like in the eyes of taxi drivers, but taxi drivers aren't sweethearts either)

An independent count with an hidden camera on a real crossing would be a better more objective count and be of real value into seeing how behavior would endanger/hinder other road users.

I'm not taking lessons in How Not To Be A Dickish Road User from the trade association of London cabbies.

You know what would be interesting

Turning on GPS tracking on your phone whilst in a bus or taxi and recording the journey. Using the camera to take photos of ASL and red light violations and bombing TFL and the PCO with this evidence

Just saying...

Typical selective commentating - basically you can make anything out to be something it isn't by focussing on the points you want to.
Consider the following "statistic" (it's not a stat, I've just made it up!)
25% of cyclists jump red lights!

That's the type of headline beloved of the Daily Wail but then if you put it as:
75% of cyclists obeyed all the road rules along with 68% of motorists in our 1hr survey at one junction.
it paints a very different picture.

What's very telling in that is they've chosen a junction where the consequences of RLJing by a cyclist are extremely minimal (therefore more are likely to do it) but they've not commented on the number of vehicles encroaching into the ASL...

"Lies, damned lies, and statistics!" (Mark Twain).

EVERYONE is using the highway code as guidelines - this is the truth of it.

What we've descended into is a petty argument that seems to be escalating. Boris isn't helping, the Police in some areas aren't helping, and some members of each of the groups of road users aren't helping to resolve the problems.

We're all people, we're all using the road, and we're all fallible. We don't have to be a***holes though.

Funny that because my experience in London as pedestrian, cyclist and driver is that most taxi drivers drive like morons.

However you interpret the stats it's still a lot of cyclists disobeying the rules..

Even if it's safe to jump to jump a red light at this particular junction you still shouldn't do it - we wouldn't accept that argument from car drivers, would we?

I don't know about London but I spent some time in York yesterday observing cyclists and didn't see a single RLJ.

Meanwhile, it my experience that most taxi drivers routinely flout speed limits. People who live in glass houses...

You've got to love how in the opening sequence of their hour-long video (at the 8 second mark), it shows a car jumping the red light. The irony of it all!