Support road.cc

Like this site? Help us to make it better.

news

“Hardly convinced the UK is ready for a cycling revolution”: Former GB News producer becomes the “pedestrian version of Jeremy Vine” and films cyclists; Pidcock to skip Cyclocross Worlds; Christmas tree with sprockets? + more on the live blog

It’s the middle of the week cycling live blog and Adwitiya is back in the not-so-hot-anymore seat with another helping of cycling news, reactions, and hopefully some funny videos too

SUMMARY

No Live Blog item found.

29 November 2023, 09:24
“Hardly convinced that the UK is ready for a cycling revolution”: Former GB News presenter becomes the “pedestrian version of Jeremy Vine” and films rule-breaking cyclists

Hooray, everyone's favourite (former) GBNews producer and anti-cycling bingo enthusiast Charlotte Gill is back at it, this time with something a bit more flamboyant and swashbuckling than what her previous attempts have been, some might say.

Her hall of fame highlights include the article in the eye-openingly conservative magazine The Critic, criticising a new study on Low Traffic Neighbourhoods, despite failing to address any of the study’s findings, as well as the elite, deluxe edition of the anti-cycling bingo with a top of the shop entering, ticking off every single uninspired checkbox: from "a war is being waged against car drivers", "a ‘Lycra Lobby’ of cycling activists and eco wonks", "I don’t drive, enjoy cycling and probably have a relatively low carbon footprint", "an assault on democracy"…

Oh before I forget, she was also behind bringing up an argument on Twitter in March that it’s mums who should stand up and oppose the dreaded Lycra lobby – because they can’t “cart around children” by bike, apparently – a claim swiftly shut down by loads of women posting pictures of them doing exactly the same activity, including Bath's bicycle mayor Saskia Heijltjes.

> “Oh dear, can you imagine being a mum carting around children”: Bath’s bicycle mayor shuts down GB News producer’s claim that mums need cars

Gill, who last month left her role as producer at GB News, was most recently under fire for comparing the 20mph speed limit in Wales to cyclists needing stabilisers. I know the list is long...

Well now, Gill has been on an expedition on the streets of London, and for once, she couldn't stop herself from applauding a cyclist, albeit only for a tiny bit of inspiration. Following in the footsteps of one "lycra-loving" Jeremy Vine, she strapped on a body cam (her iPhone) and took to the streets, becoming the "pedestrian version" of the Channel 5 presenter and "play cyclists at their own game, filming their transgressions".

Lo and behold, the inception of the one and only 'Chaz Cam', as christened by her.

> “Perhaps cars should have great big beanbags taped to them, too?” GB News producer slammed for comparing 20mph speed limits to cyclists requiring stabilisers

She wrote on her blog: "It goes without saying that cyclists aren’t as dangerous as cars on average, and of course, not everyone cycles badly. But too often you hear “it’s only a few bad eggs giving others a bad name” to minimise the number of naughty cyclists - when the issue is actually quite pronounced, as I have found. I would guess it’s more like half of cyclists behaving badly on the road, not a minority."

And in case you didn't feel like clicking on the link above this very fine day, worry not! Your live blog host has done his homework and read through Gill's handiwork, laying down all the horrible, spiteful and malicious deeds cyclists are responsible for.

It begins with probably the most common one — one which we at road.cc have also brought up in our discussions on the live blog: Going through red lights. "I lost count of the number of cyclists doing this on my day out with the Chaz Cam," she wrote.

"Although you might say I was being pedantic (well, I was pretending to be the pedestrian version of Jeremy Vine) and that cyclists may as well go through the light if no pedestrians are waiting, I found they do even when a pedestrian is there. One female cyclist dashed out at me as soon as the pedestrian light went green (see below).

> Are red-light jumping cyclists "great adverts" for cycling? Jeremy Vine seems to think so...

Alright, next up, cyclists on phones. She said: "It wasn’t unusual to see cyclists riding with one hand or none on their handlebars, as if thinking they looked extremely cool while doing so.

"One cyclist, who a van white beeped at, due to his being dangerously close in front, sped away, only to look at something other than the road (my guess being his phone)."

Cyclist jumping red light (Twitter)

> "If you don’t like cyclists going through red lights, support proper cycling infrastructure": Calls for better cycling infrastructure after cyclists jumping lights goes viral

Also in the findings of the investigation were the age-old "lighting issues" and "riding on the pavement" (cough, yesterday's live blog comes to mind, cough). And finally, she took aim at another easy target, delivery riders, claiming that they were just "bad cyclists" rushing through people for "tiny sums of money".

In conclusion? She said that the "Chaz Cam investigations" have hardly convinced her that "the UK is ready for a cycling revolution".

"The reality, in my opinion, is that half of cyclists behave well, and half of cyclists don’t. It’s definitely not the case that 'most cyclists follow the rules'," she said. "They don’t - because they perceive themselves as "the green and the good" of British society. It’s also generally my experience that most cyclists are male (and young), and the most aggressive ones almost always so, countering councils’ propaganda of inclusive transport."

So if not all cyclists are bad, and the ones which are do not cause nowhere nearly as harm or damage as a bad motorists, shouldn't by the same benchmark we all should be in agreement that the UK is also not ready for a driving revolution? Ah well.

That was quite a way to start my Wednesday, is this all a painstakingly wonderful and detailed attempt at parody or just a lousy attempt with poor arguments for cheap clicks? I feel I'm losing my mind here, help me figure this out...

29 November 2023, 13:16
Charlotte Gill's "pedestrian Jeremy Vine" impression: Your reaction

As you may have noticed, the internet has been set alight today, Jeremy Vine has been dethroned, for there is a new Jeremy Vine, albeit on foot, filming all sorts of malicious cyclists out to terrorise everyone, from motorists to pedestrians. Let's see what road.cc readers had to say about all the kerfuffle...

First off, setting the record straight, long-time reader Rendel Harris: "The pedestrian Jeremy Vine? Come off it, not a single inset meme, migraine-inducing flashing arrows or throbbing texts and no confusing 360° revolving spins of the environment from above, not a patch on our Jeremy!"

An interesting question from HoldingOn: "Do we think Charlotte Gill would have felt safe enough to run into the road waving her arms if she had just witnessed a car going through a red light?"

A couple more detailed, in-depth and passionate responses below.

Patrick9-32: "I would suggest that the iPhone Jezza take a better look at the footage she is saying is evidence of danger and ask herself, who is in danger? If a cyclist runs a red light or isnt paying attention to the road who is at risk? And if a car driver does the same, who do they endanger?

The cyclists should be obeying the traffic lights and the highway code and should not be using their phones, we should all be safe and careful, especially around pedestrians but, if things go wrong the most likely outcome is that they themselves get injured possibly with an "and...". In the case of drivers doing those same things (which they do with just as high a frequency) the likely outcome of it causing a collision is they will be completely fine and only someone else will be injured.  

If we lived in a world where car drivers were 100% safe and cyclists were still riding as they do now this would be a reasonable complaint but its completely unhinged to act like there is anything a cyclist could do that is even on the same order of magnitude of danger as a speeding driver."

OnYerBike: "I think that Gill has actually demonstrated why we do need a "cycling revolution" - because everything she captured simply demonstrates that we need proper infrastructure that meets the (separate) needs of motorists, cyclists and pedestrians. At the moment, cyclists are mostly expected to use infrastructure designed for motorists, or occassionally use infrastructure designed for pedestrians. 

For example, take the cyclist who "dashed out at me as soon as the pedestrian light went green". It seems pretty clear that the cyclist was waiting until the pedestrian phase in order to cross the junction, presumably because she didn't feel safe sharing the junction with moving motor vehicles. (Let's ignore the fact that the cyclist hardly "dashed" out and certainly not "at" Gill).

Similarly, if "most cyclists are male (and young)" that's precisely why we need better infrastructure. If it's young males at the moment, its because you need to be brave and fit to feel (relatively) comfortable sharing the road with motorists. Other groups don't cycle because they don't feel safe doing so."

Meanwhile, some reactions also from Facebook. James Thorpe said: "Much as it pains me, she probably has a point with lights and delivery app cyclists who do have a collective habit of riding like dingbats. But the rest is down to London being the (all types of) traffic Wild West and badly designed car-centric infrastructure."

Rob Wagner also commented: "I just don't get what this proves. Do cyclists do dumb things? Yes. Do they kill 100s every year, harm the environment, the local population, and contribute to the poor health of their users? No."

29 November 2023, 17:29
“Misleading” Wahoo Kickr Black Friday deal result of “simple human error”, company says
2023 Wahoo Kickr Bike Shift - 2.jpg

In September, Wahoo introduced the new Kickr Bike Shift indoor smart bike, which at £2,699.99 represented a much more affordable alternative to the existing, original Kickr Bike, priced at £3,499.99.

Wahoo has said that “confusion” around its Black Friday deals, particularly around the inclusion of a year-long membership to Zwift, was due to a “simple human error”, after one customer complained that the ‘reduced’ pricing of the fitness company’s new Kickr Bike Shift was “misleading” and a “violation of marketing laws”.

Read more: “Misleading” Wahoo Kickr Black Friday deal result of “simple human error”, company says

 

29 November 2023, 15:59
David Millar's very cool, very awesome Decathlon from back in the day (+ Jaan Kirsipuu's Penta Pro, of course)

With Decathlon announcing a return to the world's pro peloton, along with becoming the title sponsors for Team AG2R (oh and the much bemoaned loss of brown shorts too), it was only fair that the latest edition in the Bike@Bedtime series on road.cc feature one of the last few times that the French sports retailers marked its presence on the world stage, not just being ridden by none other than Team AG2R (surprise surprise), but also by Jaan Kirsipuu, becoming the first Estonian rider to win a stage in the Tour de France with his Decathlon Penta Pro.

Bike at Bedtime 2024 November 28 Decathlon Penta Pro  - 9.jpeg

> Fancy racing the Tour on this? Check out AG2R’s 2001 Decathlon Penta Pro

Sorry, allow me a second to just pause and admire this beautiful piece of machinery. They just don't make them how they used to, do they?

But besides Kirsipuu, it was brought to our attention on Twitter by James Payne, that Scottish cycling star with Tour, Giro and Vuelta stage wins under his belt, also used to be sat atop a Decathlon bike in the early noughties.

Just looook at this beauty! What a sad turn of events that Millar has now instead soured his own palette and developed an affinity for big, ugly, metal tanks.

> "When cycling superstars promote SUVs, you know we have a very big cultural problem": Former Scottish pro and national champion David Millar blasted for showing off his Ineos Grenadier

29 November 2023, 15:03
MP duped by Daily Mail article, criticises Will Norman for cutting down the famous London palm tree when it's only being relocated

Well, the Conservative MP for the Cities of London and Westminster, Nickie Aiken has just had her oopsie moment.

Using a Daily Mail article as evidence that the famous palm tree, sitting in the middle of a roundabout on the north side of Lambeth Bridge near Westminster, was going to be felled to make space for new cycle lanes.

Only that wasn't to be the case, and the Walking and Cycling Commissioner of London was quick to shut her down.

"As you know Nickie, the tree isn’t being chopped down it is being relocated to make London’s most dangerous junction safer for road users. We do not want any more fatal collisions at this location," wrote Norman, adding: "As the sign says, the [tree] is being moved not chopped down."

We all have our off days, I guess this was just one of those days for Ms Aiken.

29 November 2023, 13:31
Environmental activists oppose new cycle lane plans due to proposed relocation of trees that survived “chainsaw massacre”
Trees cut down on Armada Way, Plymouth (STRAWPlymouth)

“We need to find the right balance between creating a modern-day city centre and one that has strong environmental credentials,” the council says, arguing that moving the trees is a “vital part” of the lane’s design and will be carried out successfully.

Plans to install a new city centre cycle path on Plymouth’s Armada Way – where over 100 trees were felled by the local authority in March this year, prompting a High Court injunction and widespread protests – have been opposed by local campaigners, who have described the council’s proposal to relocate six trees that survived the so-called “midnight massacre”, to make way for the lane and a new drainage system, as a “shame”, claiming that they are unlikely to survive the relocation attempt.

> Environmental activists oppose new cycle lane plans due to proposed relocation of trees that survived “chainsaw massacre”

29 November 2023, 12:30
Christmas by cargo bike! What presents has Santa got the road.cc team this year?

Featuring our very own Santa, you may know him as Dave... Well worth a watch I'd say, just for the shenanigans and gags!

Hmm, now I wonder when does the hard-working news team at road.cc get their gifts? Surely we're not on Father Christmas' naughty list? Surely?!!

> What are the staff at road.cc getting for Christmas? Find out what's in Santa's cargo bike for some superb cycling-themed gift ideas

29 November 2023, 12:04
Proof that cyclists will make anything with bike parts #498

"Can you take a look at my bike, the gears are making a tinselly noise"

A Christmas tree with some 250 sprockets? I see we've got some very different interpretation of what a Christmas tree is...

 
29 November 2023, 11:50
No Cyclocross Worlds Championship for Tom Pidcock

Tom Pidcock's winter calendar is out, and it crushes my heart to see that the mercurial young Brit will be giving the UCI Cyclocross World Championships, to be held in Tábor in February a pass.

But Pidcock will at least try to keep us entertained in road racing's off-season by taking part in at least six of the CX World Cup events, starting with the race in Namur, Belgium on December 17, before saying adiós in Benidorm, Spain (or as some may call it, the natural hunting ground for Brits seeking warmth), and preparing for hopefully another spectacular road season.

And if you're really in need of all the races that the Big Three (MvdP, WvA, TP) will be showing up for, we've got you covered.

29 November 2023, 11:43
"What's in the box?!" "A joke, sir"

An absolutely hilarious product found by Ryan on the Zwift Riders' group. You can rest assured we wouldn't peddle any such non-sense on our Black Friday/Cyber Monday/Deals November/Deavember blogs.

Bicycle seat belt
29 November 2023, 10:57
Time for some very meta blogging...

A very meta-Wednesday with this post on the live blog; road.cc reporting on the live blog about the reaction to London Cycling Campaign reporting about Simon’s cargo bike blog on road.cc.

There were, as usual, a few naysayers and disbelievers in the power of the cargo bike, but LCC wasn't going to let them have their way.

29 November 2023, 10:24
"Tell me you don't pay for your own bike without telling me you don't pay for your own bike": Ben Swift dips his wheels in the National Cycling Network pool

I mean if I had free access to as many shiny new bikes with shiny new tech, I won't mind dipping into this stretch of the NCN with my teammate and cousin...

> National Cycle Network or the world’s hardest cyclocross course?

The real question now is, when do we see the Swift cousins trace their way through a treacherous, watery, muddy CX course? Hold on, I'll send an email to Ineos and ask them...

Adwitiya joined road.cc in 2023 as a news writer after graduating with a masters in journalism from Cardiff University. His dissertation focused on active travel, which soon threw him into the deep end of covering everything related to the two-wheeled tool, and now cycling is as big a part of his life as guitars and football. He has previously covered local and national politics for Voice Wales, and also likes to writes about science, tech and the environment, if he can find the time. Living right next to the Taff trail in the Welsh capital, you can find him trying to tackle the brutal climbs in the valleys.

Add new comment

91 comments

Avatar
brooksby replied to S13SFC | 4 months ago
1 like

S13SFC wrote:

Grasses? How old are you? 13?

Maybe they were an extra on The Sweeney, back in the day?

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to Left_is_for_Losers | 4 months ago
10 likes

Left_is_for_Losers wrote:

Haha look now, all those grasses who film people don't like being filmed themselves! Should be zero complaints from most on here

Not a single complaint in these comments thus far about being filmed, not one. People are criticising the stupid interpretations the "journalist" has made things that she films, but not one person has complained about her filming. You've made yourself look a bit of an arse there (again).

As I'm doubtless right up there on your list of "grasses", for the record anyone is welcome to film me on the road at any time, I've got nothing to worry about just as the majority of safe, law-abiding drivers have nothing to worry about from me filming them.

Avatar
HoldingOn replied to Rendel Harris | 4 months ago
14 likes

Rendel Harris wrote:

Not a single complaint in these comments thus far about being filmed, not one.

I'll go one step further - I would be very happy for (in fact I would absolutely encourage it) a police officer to follow me every time I go out on my bicycle.

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to HoldingOn | 4 months ago
8 likes

HoldingOn wrote:

I'll go one step further - I would be very happy for (in fact I would absolutely encourage it) a police officer to follow me every time I go out on my bicycle.

Indeed, it can be hilarious sometimes when you're riding along at, say, 20 in a 20 zone and thinking well everyone's very polite today, nobody is trying to pass me, the oncoming drivers are all driving at a reasonable speed and waiting for me to come through before pulling to my side of the road if they need to…then you get to the lights and look round and find there's a police car somewhere in the cars behind you!

Avatar
chrisonabike replied to HoldingOn | 4 months ago
4 likes

HoldingOn wrote:

Rendel Harris wrote:

Not a single complaint in these comments thus far about being filmed, not one.

I'll go one step further - I would be very happy for (in fact I would absolutely encourage it) a police officer to follow me every time I go out on my bicycle.

Excellent suggestion.  You could call it a "red lantern act" - every cyclist upon the king's highway should be followed by a copper waving a red light.  That would warn motorists about the potential hold up and inconvenience also!

Could this cause problems for the police though, due to the number of road offenses they would have to fail to observe (problems outside of Scotland and Lancashire that is)?

Avatar
Left_is_for_Losers replied to Left_is_for_Losers | 4 months ago
1 like

Left_is_for_Losers wrote:

Haha look now, all those grasses who film people don't like being filmed themselves! Should be zero complaints from most on here

Look at all this frothing, they do say the cut hog squeals the loudest 

Avatar
perce replied to Left_is_for_Losers | 4 months ago
7 likes

I think it's quite sad that you have to reply to your own comments.

Avatar
Left_is_for_Losers replied to Left_is_for_Losers | 4 months ago
2 likes

Left_is_for_Losers wrote:

Left_is_for_Losers wrote:

Haha look now, all those grasses who film people don't like being filmed themselves! Should be zero complaints from most on here

Look at all this frothing, they do say the cut hog squeals the loudest 

Better than having multiple accounts to reply to myself with eh Clem/Perce?

Avatar
Rendel Harris replied to Left_is_for_Losers | 4 months ago
1 like

Left_is_for_Losers wrote:

Better than having multiple accounts to reply to myself with eh Clem/Perce?

Avatar
levestane | 4 months ago
1 like

"I would guess it’s more like half ..." doesn't seem consistent with doing 'research'. Maybe a random sample with appropriate stats would help.

Avatar
OnYerBike | 4 months ago
12 likes

I think that Gill has actually demonstrated why we do need a "cycling revolution" - because everything she captured simply demonstrates that we need proper infrastructure that meets the (separate) needs of motorists, cyclists and pedestrians. At the moment, cyclists are mostly expected to use infrastructure designed for motorists, or occassionally use infrastructure designed for pedestrians. 

For example, take the cyclist who "dashed out at me as soon as the pedestrian light went green". It seems pretty clear that the cyclist was waiting until the pedestrian phase in order to cross the junction, presumably because she didn't feel safe sharing the junction with moving motor vehicles. (Let's ignore the fact that the cyclist hardly "dashed" out and certainly not "at" Gill).

Similarly, if "most cyclists are male (and young)" that's precisely why we need better infrastructure. If it's young males at the moment, its because you need to be brave and fit to feel (relatively) comfortable sharing the road with motorists. Other groups don't cycle because they don't feel safe doing so.

Avatar
cyclisto replied to OnYerBike | 4 months ago
2 likes

We definitely do need better infra, but it will not fix cyclists on phone while riding on roads shared with cars. To me it seems more dangerous than the stuck in traffic drivers Mickey catches.

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
6 likes

cyclisto wrote:

We definitely do need better infra, but it will not fix cyclists on phone while riding on roads shared with cars. To me it seems more dangerous than the stuck in traffic drivers Mickey catches.

Yes, but dangerous to whom?

A cyclist on a phone is at risk of losing control and getting themselves hurt. A driver on a phone is at risk of not seeing someone and causing a KSI.

Note that one of those cases is illegal and the other isn't which reinforces that one causes far more danger than the other.

Avatar
cyclisto replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
2 likes

A distracted cyclist can cause a car to go off planned course and cause serious accident. The standing still drivers stuck at traffic, hardly seem a danger to me, the only danger in Mickey's videos is himself going back and creating tension that could distract car drivers on the not stuck direction.

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
4 likes

cyclisto wrote:

A distracted cyclist can cause a car to go off planned course and cause serious accident. The standing still drivers stuck at traffic, hardly seem a danger to me, the only danger in Mickey's videos is himself going back and creating tension that could distract car drivers on the not stuck direction.

Why would a distracted cyclist cause a driver to crash and has that ever happened?

Meanwhile it takes approximately 30-40 seconds for a distracted driver to sufficiently pay attention to their surroundings after looking up from their phone. This is why you see RTCs caused by drivers just following the vehicle in front as they haven't clued themselves into the situation fully after using their phone. It's a real problem and that's why it's illegal to be using a phone when driving even if the car is stationary.

As an example, if a pedestrian decides to cross the road between stationary cars that are stuck in traffic, then a driver may see the car in front starting to move and assume that they can also move forward, but unless they look up and actually pay attention, the crossing pedestrian will likely get injured.

Avatar
cyclisto replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
1 like

One of the scariest moments of my cyclist life is when stray dogs popped up in front of me just a few meters in front and instinctively changed lane without checking traffic to avoid them. It was a wrong decision because if a vehicle had been passing me, I would be dead now, but I had no time to think. Had the dogs been a cyclist on phone and I was driving a truck, I could have made a great mess.

Everything that moves on the road, must be under control.

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
3 likes

cyclisto wrote:

One of the scariest moments of my cyclist life is when stray dogs popped up in front of me just a few meters in front and instinctively changed lane without checking traffic to avoid them. It was a wrong decision because if a vehicle had been passing me, I would be dead now, but I had no time to think. Had the dogs been a cyclist on phone and I was driving a truck, I could have made a great mess.

Everything that moves on the road, must be under control.

How exactly do dogs "pop up" in front of you? Where they underneath a manhole cover and were climbing up the ladder?

With a cyclist and a truck, why would the truck be following so close behind the cyclist as to cause a collision and why would you blame the cyclist for that?

Also, if my aunt had balls, she'd be my uncle (though her pronouns may stay the same)

 

Avatar
cyclisto replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
1 like

They were lying on the side of the road in shadow and then pop up, because sometimes cyclists seem like a giant kebab for untrained dogs.

The truck could similarly overtake a cyclist and he could start changing course. In general if you try to take eyes off road and try to control arguably the hardest to control vehicle with one hand, crazy things can happen, it's not that rocket imagination.

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
3 likes

cyclisto wrote:

They were lying on the side of the road in shadow and then pop up, because sometimes cyclists seem like a giant kebab for untrained dogs.

The truck could similarly overtake a cyclist and he could start changing course. In general if you try to take eyes off road and try to control arguably the hardest to control vehicle with one hand, crazy things can happen, it's not that rocket imagination.

So why would the truck driver be overtaking a cyclist and not leaving enough room? How would a safe overtake leave the driver at risk of crashing if the cyclist got distracted?

My interpretation of safe roadcraft would be that the truck driver might start to perform a safe overtake and if the cyclist starts drifting in front of them, they'd brake and abort the overtake. They'd probably feel agrieved and use their horn angrily, but how would it cause a crash?

Is this an actual scenario or just a thought experiment?

 

Avatar
cyclisto replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
1 like

My dog example was to showcase that when something goes out of control, bigger unexpected problems may occur, affecting other people. You may say your scenario, I may refer another (also real to me) example when a rider holding with one hand handlebars turned in a crazy angle, and you come up with another scenario etc etc and continue forever

I believe that riding a bike while holding and talking to a phone an one hand, is dangerous for both the rider but other road users as well, so this Final Destination scenario making will not lead anywhere.

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
2 likes

cyclisto wrote:

My dog example was to showcase that when something goes out of control, bigger unexpected problems may occur, affecting other people. You may say your scenario, I may refer another (also real to me) example when a rider holding with one hand handlebars turned in a crazy angle, and you come up with another scenario etc etc and continue forever

I believe that riding a bike while holding and talking to a phone an one hand, is dangerous for both the rider but other road users as well, so this Final Destination scenario making will not lead anywhere.

A cyclist can turn "in a crazy angle" to simply avoid a pothole and that should not cause a collision, but could cause a driver to perform an emergency stop. I just don't think any of your examples demonstrate a danger to someone in a vehicle.

Avatar
KDee replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
2 likes

Better not take a hand off the handlebar to signal, fiddle with my bike computer, ring the bell, wipe snot from my nose, take a drink...

Avatar
brooksby replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
4 likes

hawkinspeter wrote:

cyclisto wrote:

They were lying on the side of the road in shadow and then pop up, because sometimes cyclists seem like a giant kebab for untrained dogs.

The truck could similarly overtake a cyclist and he could start changing course. In general if you try to take eyes off road and try to control arguably the hardest to control vehicle with one hand, crazy things can happen, it's not that rocket imagination.

So why would the truck driver be overtaking a cyclist and not leaving enough room? How would a safe overtake leave the driver at risk of crashing if the cyclist got distracted?

My interpretation of safe roadcraft would be that the truck driver might start to perform a safe overtake and if the cyclist starts drifting in front of them, they'd brake and abort the overtake. They'd probably feel agrieved and use their horn angrily, but how would it cause a crash?

Is this an actual scenario or just a thought experiment?

My daughter has just started driving lessons.  I asked her about passing distances, as she's cramming for her theory test.  I explained it as "You should pass them with enough space that if they suddenly fell over, you wouldn't drive over them".

Avatar
Hirsute replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
6 likes

Eh ???
You are supposed to give cyclists tons of room precisely because they can change direction.
HC 163

Avatar
Geoff Ingram replied to hawkinspeter | 4 months ago
2 likes

I was riding an unlit trail about dawnish, ten or twelve years ago, with a, for that time, enormously powerful newfangled magicshine led light, when a dog, not on lead, obvs, made a flying entrance, stage left, straight for the light, the only thing it noticed. Not exactle pop up, but they can do strange and unexpected appearances out of nowhere. Broken collarbone...

Avatar
hawkinspeter replied to Geoff Ingram | 4 months ago
5 likes

Geoff Ingram wrote:

I was riding an unlit trail about dawnish, ten or twelve years ago, with a, for that time, enormously powerful newfangled magicshine led light, when a dog, not on lead, obvs, made a flying entrance, stage left, straight for the light, the only thing it noticed. Not exactle pop up, but they can do strange and unexpected appearances out of nowhere. Broken collarbone...

Broken collie-bone?

Avatar
GMBasix replied to cyclisto | 4 months ago
2 likes

cyclisto wrote:

One of the scariest moments of my cyclist life is when stray dogs popped up in front of me just a few meters in front and instinctively changed lane without checking traffic to avoid them. It was a wrong decision because if a vehicle had been passing me, I would be dead now, but I had no time to think. Had the dogs been a cyclist on phone and I was driving a truck, I could have made a great mess.

Everything that moves on the road, must be under control.

The dog instinctively changed lane? Or a missing "I"?

In any case, any dog having the capacity to pop up in front of me - whether because it is off the lead or on a ridiculously long lead - makes me take pre-emptive action long before it has a chance to pop up anywhere. "Instinctively" changing lane is not instinct, it's acquired habit. Time to change that habit, whether cycling or driving.

You shouldn't be changing lane without knowing your destination lane is clear enough to do so. if you haven't been monitoring traffic enough to know what's around you, the only correct thing to do is brake to avoid or mitigate an impact.

Avatar
cyclisto replied to GMBasix | 4 months ago
1 like

Yes I missed an I.

The dogs were in a shadow of a bus stop and mixed around people, I don't think I could have ever seen them even if I looked there.

Of course I shouldn't be changing lane without knowing my destination lane is clear. But the time margin was very minimal and I was going at my full flat cruise commuter speed.

Now thinking though, you must be right, I indeed mostly swerve to avoid obstacles. I should start practice braking than swerving for such cases where no other option is available.

Avatar
Adam Sutton replied to OnYerBike | 4 months ago
2 likes

Sadly my experience of cyclists using dedicated infra in West London is one where they still ignore signals that are dedicated to cyclists and ignore pedestrians on the crossings, and waiting to cross.

At the same time though there needs to be common sense to attitude on shared infrastructure. As an example where it makes no sense not to wait at lights I will wait, but there always will be instances where it is better both for my safety and traffic flow for me to go through a red light. Prime example is where I cut through an ASDA car park to avoid a major roundabout. I used to stop at the lights, but after an instance of a driver overtaking and cutting across my path to go to the petrol station, and multiple stupid MGIFs as the lights change, i will now go through the red as soon as I can see no more traffic is coming in from the opposite direction.

Edited: to clarify the inclusion of pedestrians waiting to cross and not just just cyclists passing those crossing. - hope that is OK.

Avatar
chrisonabike replied to Adam Sutton | 4 months ago
1 like

Adam Sutton wrote:

Sadly my experience of cyclists using dedicated infra in West London is one where they still ignore signals that are dedicated to cyclists and ignore pedestrians on the crossings, and waiting to cross.

At the same time though there needs to be common sense to attitude on shared infrastructure. As an example where it makes no sense not to wait at lights I will wait, but there always will be instances where it is better both for my safety and traffic flow for me to go through a red light. ...

We're in a growth / transition phase (hopefully) with cycling.  So - perhaps in a generation (very optimistically) if we have "mass cycling" in some places* we'll see similar levels of compliance to rules (or alternatively similar levels of asshattery) as for people driving cars.

The other reason for saying "generation" is that we have no formal means of educating road users.  There is no road user training - even the driving test is a once-a-lifetime occurrence.

In fact since cycling is a more "casual" mode you might expect cyclists to be about as "well behaved" as people walking (if they were less worried about cars).  I guess that depends on overall assessment of personal danger, people being more motivated to look out for themselves than others.

Of course engineering can help guide people.  In your example I'd guess if there was a cycle lane buypassing that red light - even if say you were sometimes held at a cycle red light - you'd take it?

* Say 10% or more of trips being cycled.  Obviously this is not the same as peak flows in certain places; says here that in 2015 "bikes now make up around 16 per cent of traffic in Central London, rising to around a quarter during peak hours"!  (I think I find the first more astonishing if correct.)

Pages

Latest Comments