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news
London Concrete lorry and bikes (copyright Simon MacMichael) "Ignorant and grotesque" - CTC blasts article on cyclists by Road Haulage Association director
In an article that national cyclists’ organisation the CTC has described as “unbelievably ignorant and grotesque,” the head of the Road Haulage Association (RHA) in Scotland says cyclists should carry insurance and maintains that those using iPods and similar devices when cycling should be charged with an offence of “cycling without due care, etc.”
Phil Flanders, the RHA’s Scottish Director, also warns lorry drivers that police are acting upon helmet camera footage provided by cyclists, should a driver be “unfortunate to upset them on the roads.” The fact that police will only do so when they suspect the driver has committed an offence is not acknowledged, however.
Writing in issue 65 of transport industry magazine FACTS, ” Mr Flanders unleashes a broadside against bike riders that, coming from such a senior figure within the haulage industry, makes for depressing reading.
In his article, Mr Flanders displays some of the entrenched attitudes against bike riders that cycling campaigners and politicians in London and elsewhere are up against in trying to improve the safety of cyclists around lorries following a string of recent fatalities.
It’s a sad but inescapable fact that lorries are responsible for a disproportionate number of cycling fatalities – the CTC says HGVs make up 5 per cent of traffic, but are responsible for 19 per cent of the deaths of cyclists on Britain’s roads.
Indeed, Mr Flanders begins his piece by acknowledging, “There have been a spate of accidents involving cyclists and lorries recently,” but adds, “as usual the lorry is the big bad bogeyman.
“It reminded me of an article I read last year in New Zealand where they have a similar problem,” he continues.
The RHA director goes on to cite large parts of that article, headed Cyclists and Cars are a Fatal Mix and emphatically anti-cyclist in tone, which originally appeared in the New Zealand Herald in November 2010 and was written by the newspaper’s motoring correspondent, Eric Thompson.
“A public road with motor vehicles is no place for a cyclist, no matter how they bleat about having every right to be in the same place as a car. A cyclist will always come off second best in an accident with a motor vehicle,” wrote Mr Thompson.
“No matter whose fault it is, in any type of motor versus pushbike altercation it’s not going to take a rocket scientist to work out who’s going to end up in the back of an ambulance,” he added.
His article went on to set out a number of legal requirements that he believed bicycles and their riders should be subject to, “as other vehicles are required by law.”
Those included the fitting of rear-view mirrors, indicators, riding in single file unless overtaking, having front light on at all times [as he says other two-wheeled vehicles in New Zealand have to do, riders to pass a “road-license test,” and bikes to be registered and subject to “road tax.”
Since all those points in the New Zealand Herald article are repeated, verbatim, by Mr Flanders, without comment or qualification, it’s reasonable to assume that he’s in agreement with them.
Mr Flanders, however, does have some suggestions of his own.
“I would go further and add that all must have adequate insurance for any accidents they cause and maybe even liability insurance for those who knock people down,” he writes, although he seems to present as two different types of insurance what is essentially one and the same thing – third party liability cover, which many cyclists, such as CTC members, already carry.
“Those cyclists, and there are many, who play their iPods or other types of mobile music should also be charged for committing an offence of cycling without due care etc etc as they have no chance of hearing any vehicle approaching and are totally unaware of what is going on around them,” he adds.
Now, many cyclists agree that you shouldn’t listen to music while you ride, not least world champion Mark Cavendish, who last month said, “Don’t cycle with an iPod in, it’s dangerous!”
At present, it’s entirely legal to ride a bicycle while listening to music, just as it is legal for a lorry driver to listen to it in their cab. Of course, many riders choose not to do so on the grounds that they want to be as aware as they can of everything going on around them.
Finally, Mr Flanders warns lorry drivers: “Some [cyclists] have started to fit small video cameras to their helmets. If you are unfortunate to upset them on the roads they will report you to the authorities and will have evidence of whatever it was that you did. There are cases of this already where the police have taken action!”
That comment, presumably, isn’t aimed at those among the RHA’s membership who drive within the law and therefore have nothing to fear from the police.
In response to Mr Flanders’ comments, a spokeman for the CTC told road.cc: “This is an unbelievably ignorant and grotesque statement.
“The only accurate thing he says is that some cyclists are now recording illegal behaviour by lorry drivers using helmet cameras - implying that the incessant illegal behaviour by his members might, shock horror, actually lead to prosecution.
“We already warn cyclists to stay away from heavy vehicles - knowing that idiots like this could be behind the wheel is truly worrying."
Officially, the RHA highlights that cyclists need "to be careful around trucks," but it also states that cyclists need to be better educated about how lorries execute manoeuvres at junctions in particular. It expresses concerns about safety equipment such as sensors being the answer to improving the safety of bike riders where HGVs are concerned, and points out that "RHA Training includes cyclist awareness in its driver refresher courses."
In response to Mr Flanders' comments, the RHA said: "The article you refer to is part of a regular column and is a personal report of views from around the world on this important subject, including views from a senior safety engineer at the world's largest commercial
vehicle manufacturer. To call the article "ignorant and grotesque" does nothing to contribute to sensible debate on what is an important subject.
"The RHA is actively exploring ways to achieve greater safety of cyclists around HGVs and other freight vehicles, particularly with Transport for London and the Metropolitan Police. A longer RHA comment on this important subject, dated June 30 2011, is on our website."
Simon joined road.cc as news editor in 2009 and is now the site’s community editor, acting as a link between the team producing the content and our readers. A law and languages graduate, published translator and former retail analyst, he has reported on issues as diverse as cycling-related court cases, anti-doping investigations, the latest developments in the bike industry and the sport’s biggest races. Now back in London full-time after 15 years living in Oxford and Cambridge, he loves cycling along the Thames but misses having his former riding buddy, Elodie the miniature schnauzer, in the basket in front of him.
Latest Comments
- neilmck 0 sec ago
The idea of the leaflet they fill-in as they build the bike is to make sure they do not make a mistake. However if they just fill it in beforehand...
- pockstone 16 min 12 sec ago
The law of unintended consequences applies even to the likes of PD MP....
- essexian 41 min 44 sec ago
BBC News. Its easy to find: sadly.
- RoubaixCube 7 hours 23 min ago
And if you put the Gamel Helmet on back to front. You could become Robocop!
- Oldfatgit 8 hours 33 min ago
On the other hand though ......
- David9694 9 hours 5 min ago
Yeah, this whole thing can really just get to fuck. But that's what we're up against - the normalisation of the plucky chancer driver, the...
- don simon fbpe 10 hours 31 min ago
There are times when I think that these right whinger accounts are left wingers in drag, the aguments they espouse are so ridiculous, or don't...
- Cayo 10 hours 33 min ago
Or any non-drivist. A few years back, I was walking and crossing a side road not far from home. The road has particularly wide corners, especially...
- wtjs 11 hours 18 min ago
This was it in November 2022. Now you see the futility of reporting things to the police or DVLA
- katar_6 11 hours 23 min ago
I'm trying to login at my mobile and it says I need to subscreve. What should I do?
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66 comments
@Goldfish You only have to look at the piss-poor driving and appalling attitude towards cyclists exhibited by drivers who have, remarkably, passed the requisite tests to realise that any similar license requirement for cyclists will make little difference to actual behaviour. We have a major issue in the UK: Driver Attitude Problem. Until that is sorted out (don't hold your breath) then conditions on our roads for cyclists (and, arguably, all road users) will continue to deteriorate.
The odd things is that IMX most HGV drivers are courteous and respectful of cyclists. Granted, I work in a town where most HGV movement is by the big boys (DHL, Bibby etc.) rather than one-man bands (the 'Alf Robertson Haulage's of this world). But I never, ever, have a problem with HGVs. It's ordinary car drivers, and in particular, minicab drivers who cause the problems.
(I accept that the situation is clearly different in London.)
Erm, I was under the impression we have MORE rights. Pedestrians, horse riders and cyclists have a 'right' to use Her Majesty's highways and byeways. Lorry drivers etc. are required to hold a 'licence' and therefore it is a priveledge, not a right, for them to be on the road.
Road excise duty paid by HGV's is in no way proportionate to the human and environmental damage they cause.
Both the legal and moral implications written by this individual show him up for the kretin he is.
"It's a hard job. Change gear, change gear, change gear, check mirror, murder a prostitute, change gear, change gear, murder. That's a lot of effort in a day."
We all know that cyclists have the same rights as other road users. Fact is "other road users" just dont all see it this way.
I for one wouldn't even consider riding in London, and avoid all busy roads when possible.
For me cycling is a sport/hobby it is only rarely a means of transport in terms of getting anywhere, I use my car as I like my body and don't really want to be almost killed or maimed every 30 seconds.
Shame but I cant see things changing anytime soon, cycling on busy roads just too dangerous in my eyes.
Wow. How do people like this get out of bed in the morning? Aren't they scared the sky might fall on their heads? After all, they ignore the evidence about how safe cycling is, so why not ignore it about the sky falling in?
The mass of Transport for London hire bikes and commuters riding west along Tavistock Place in the mornings is a sight to behold and I've not seen a crash yet. If only everywhere had that many bicycles, it would probably be pretty safe because they'd be very obvious to drivers.
What an awful man. I've been having a look at cameras for a while. If their use annoys that cretin I've just been given an additional reason to buy one in the sales.
There were some good point made.
Cycling with headphones/earbuds etc is really too dangerous for urban riding. But it shouldn't be made illegal outright.
Cyclists should have insurance, but this shouldn't be mandatory. It should be made cheap and widely available though (does a pedestrian need insurance in case they cause an accident resulting in injury or damages?).
There should be more education and training programs for cyclists, but like the insurance it should be optional, cheap, accessible for all to participate.
Lights on during the day, again is a solid suggestion, I do it myself! However should this be mandatory? No I don't think so, it should be encouraged though in the same way it is encouraged here in Aus for all vehicles "headlights save lives".
Etc.
So people get used to looking out for motor vehicle headlights and ignore cyclists? I could leave my bike lights on during the day but I don't think they'd be any use.
@ goldfish - I am going to assume that you are being ironic or are you playing devils advocate?? All these suggestions of cyclists doing tests, taking out insurance, paying VED ad nauseam are all well and good. The main issue is one that is never addressed by lobbyists - that of the behaviour and shit poor driving standards in this country. Until that happens our roads will never be safe and the media and lobbyists will continue to take ground by giving the impression that cycling is dangerous - helmets ,hi vis clothing, insurance, tests.
I am fed up seeing drivers treating vulnerable road users with total and utter contempt and believing that they own the road because the pay what they believe is road tax. At least the RHA is making inroads by teaching their members cycle awareness.
Oh and there is training provided for cyclists. It's called Bikeabilty, formally cycling proficiency. I still have my badge
Some of the points that the writer from the RHA raises do have credence. Why not have a test that all road using cyclists have to pass before they can ride on the road? It would make the riders more aware of what they "should" be doing. You don't pass it, you can ride your bike...simples!
Why not tax?..pass your test you can apply for a tax disc - £10.00 - ride like you don't belong on the road, tax disc cancelled and you have to retake the test. If instead of bicycles we were talking "cars" or "motorbikes" there'd be no complaints, but because we're talking bicycles there's outrage.....why?
To be really controversial I think that this should also apply to horse riders who want to use the road...no test, no road use!
@Goldfish - But then we are left in the same situation we currently have with motor vehicles. How many cars are on the roads without either the vehicle or the person behind the wheel passing the appropriate tests? Laws are only as good as the enforcement at the end of the day.
Also to implement a system would surely require some sort of registration scheme for cyclists, which I think has been covered before and both the costs to setup and the ongoing running costs FAR outweigh any money the scheme could hope to make!
Call Phil on xxxxx xxxxxx
Edited, see comment by Nick below
Hi dream, I've taken a note of the number which I'll pass to Simon for the morning but in the meantime I hope you don't mind that I've taken Mr Flanders' mobile number off a public forum out of respect for his privacy.
p.flanders [at] rha.uk.net
Mr Slanders, oh! sorry! Mr Flanders, if there were such thing as "Road Tax" what would it be based upon? vehicle weight, or emissions? A bicycle is neither heavy enough to cause damage to road surfaces or polluting to the environment.
"The RHA is actively exploring ways to achieve greater safety of cyclists around HGVs and other freight vehicles, particularly with Transport for London and the Metropolitan Police. A longer RHA comment on this important subject, dated June 30 2011, is on our website."
Shame it's a member's only page and I can't get to read it.
Sorry about that - I've changed it to the link to the same document that we already had in the story, that should let you in.
Isn't this something we hear all the time from cycling advocates? Mr.Thompson is reflecting back cycling-fear as promulgated by people that presume to speak for all cyclists.
Before anyone goes completely mental, according to this web page: http://www.nlphighland.co.uk/businessnlp.asp Phil Flanders of the RHA would love to talk to you...
I'll go and check out his article and will then respond to him by letter. Given my job I'm in a position to put him straight on any points he makes that are factually incorrect. The RHA is in many respects a forward thinking organisation. I suspect that a few words from people with influence may well see this spanner forced to retract his words or resign.
Ok, so I've read the piece now. The RHA will be getting a communication from me. I'll let ya'll know the response.
Just to clarify on a couple of the comments above, the reference to 'road tax' was from the NZ Herald article that he cited (and unusually, in NZ revenue raised from motorists does in fact specifically go to help pay for the roads), as were the bits about emissions, and cyclists wanting to share the road.
Mr Flanders didn't make it entirely clear in his article which bits were his opinion and which were from the NZ Herald article, so we went back to the source and did it for him in ours.
In my view it's not so much what he says, it's the way that he says it that's the problem. Comments like
are clearly meant to incite a reaction rather than stimulate any sort of reasoned debate.
But, I have to admit that I have some sympathy with some of the comments that he makes (not all, but some!). For example, only yesterday I posted an article on my own blog about whether or not I should get myself some liability insurance. I'm conducting a poll on my blog if anyone wants to participate!
I also see, virtually on a daily basis, cyclists doing stupid things and putting themselves, and others, in danger. I also see car/bus/taxi/lorry drivers doing dangerous things on a regular basis as well.
So, neither side in this argument is entirely without fault. But this guy's attitude stinks!
“There have been a spate of accidents involving cyclists and lorries recently,” but adds, “as usual the lorry is the big bad bogeyman."
What a moron. Poor lorry drivers made to feel bad for killing an inconsiderate cyclist.
I agree with the fact that we shouldn't be sharing the road with motor vehicles, we should have safe cycle lanes. A 12yr old boy came to visit us on his bike, he cycled on the road! he told us that only children up to the age of 10 can cycle on the pavement - it's absolutely disgusting that we don't have safe cycle lanes as they do in the Netherlands, Denmark etc. Children battling with manic drivers in HGVs.
Yes and he lived. I don't see a problem with riding on the road, as I did from age 8 or so. Most cycle tracks are awful and I'd prefer a wider road instead. However, a few more like Mr Flanders and I may change my mind!
All I can say is Beeching has a lot to answer for (because if it weren't for him a lot more freight would be going by rail now)! Once the Gotthard Base Tunnel is complete no freight will cross Switzerland by road. But I digress.
Getting back to the point, it isn't just cyclists that don't know about trucks and corners. Car drivers are just as ignorant of how much space they need, there are plenty of accidents (and fatalities) where cars are crushed by lorries.
The only good thing about this story is that it shows just how ridiculous his arguments are. Now if he had suggested that trucks counter-strike with their own cameras to see the idiocy of some cyclists, he would have had a good point.
My word. Just *how* uninformed is this man?? Not only does he prat on about 'road tax' and how he thinks cyclists should have to pay it, but he then goes on to admit that we should get a reduction for low emissions!! So presumably that means zero emission equals zero road tax. Er, that's where we are now, Mr Flanders.
And have you read the rest of the article where he blethers on -completely ill-informed- about volcanic eruptions cancelling out humanity's efforts to reduce our CO2 emissions? By his own admissions, he's not even bothered to validate his 'research' (why would he, it so neatly suits his agenda) but if he tried, he'd be looking a while, because it's utter nonsense. Volcanic eruptions are *natural* and taken care of by the carbon cycle. Everything we add overbalances the cycle. Duh.
Grade A moron. Unfortunately, someone gave him a lectern, a microphone and a magazine :\
Yeah, I would agree with some comments - not listening to music, awareness of heavy vehicles. The rest - total mince!! Mr Flanders seems to be unaware that the police can charge a cyclist if they believe they are cycling in a manner that is dangerous to themselves and others. On an aside I wonder what Mr Flanders has to say on the issue of lorries consistantly breaking the speed limit...
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