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Woman suffers punctured lung and broken ribs as horse she was riding spooked by cyclist who undertook them without warning

Woman urges cyclists to learn how to share space safely with people on horseback after spending four days in hospital

A horse rider who was left with four broken ribs and a punctured lung when her horse was spooked by an undertaking cyclist says people on bikes need to be more aware of how to share the road safely with those on horseback.

The rider, whose name was given only as Karen, had almost returned to her yard after a ride on her horse Polly when the incident happened last Tuesday, the Horse & Hound reports. No details of the location were provided.

She said: “There was no traffic. I didn’t hear the cyclist and he didn’t shout to say he was passing – there were only inches between the edge of the road, him and me. 

“He came so close he was just about touching my stirrup. Polly got a fright and jumped off all four legs across the road.

“There was a lay-by across the road with a parked car and Polly went into the car and I came off. I remember not being able to breathe or speak.”

An occupant of one of two vehicles that stopped at the scene happened to be a nurse who works in A&E and called for an ambulance.

“I could see the cyclist stopped but he never came over and then he was gone,” Karen continued. “He left me.”

Her horse, a 15-year-old mare, was found at the stables.

After spending four days in hospital, Karen is now recovering at home.

She said: “I’m very sore even on painkillers. I left hospital on Saturday evening and still have a raspy voice from the chest drain they had to put in.

“It’s taking me a long time to get dressed and showered and I have my daughter staying with me for two weeks to help me,” she added.

The incident happened two months after a man taking part in the Windsor Triathlon, riding in the cycling leg of the event, undertook a horse rider at speed, making contact with her as he passed.

Several other people participating in the event also passed the horse and rider without slowing down, and subsequently organisers Human Race confirmed that one man had been banned from its events for life and another for 12 months.

> Police probing triathlon cyclist's undertake of horse rider

The episode was captured on the horse rider’s action camera and after road.cc’s initial coverage the story was picked up by the mainstream media.

The incident was also being investigated by Thames Valley Police, whom we have contacted for an update.

Rule 215 of the Highway Code, among other things, instructs road users to “Be particularly careful of horse riders and horse-drawn vehicles especially when overtaking,” and to “Always pass wide and slowly.”

More extensive guidance on how cyclists and horse riders can share the road safely has been issued by the British Horse Society (BHS) and is endorsed by British Cycling, and is covered in a road.cc article that can be found by following the link below.

> How to pass horse riders safely on your bike

Simon joined road.cc as news editor in 2009 and is now the site’s community editor, acting as a link between the team producing the content and our readers. A law and languages graduate, published translator and former retail analyst, he has reported on issues as diverse as cycling-related court cases, anti-doping investigations, the latest developments in the bike industry and the sport’s biggest races. Now back in London full-time after 15 years living in Oxford and Cambridge, he loves cycling along the Thames but misses having his former riding buddy, Elodie the miniature schnauzer, in the basket in front of him.

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vonhelmet replied to Pushing50 | 5 years ago
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Pushing50 wrote:
vonhelmet wrote:
Pushing50 wrote:
vonhelmet wrote:

How about the post a page ago where someone said the rider was lying to the police because of concerns about insurance? That was a good one.

JESUS!!!!! Read the post again!!!!! Who said she was lying to the police!!! I am not even going to explain. Good luck with your interpretation of that post.

Who said she was lying to the police? Maybe the person who suggested that the cyclist didn’t exist and that the horse rider made it up to avoid liability on her horse hitting the car or whatever.

I mean, how can you think that wouldn’t constitute lying in that strange little fantasy? It’s literally exactly what was being suggested.

FYI here is the original paragraph written by myself. Please note the very first sentence and especially the words that are bracketed. 

Maybe (and this is purely a personal theory - no evidence so cannot be seen as my belief or the TRUTH) she caused a lot of damage to the parked car with her horse, knew the owner of the parked car, is liable for causing the damage running to the costs of thousands and is not insured for third party liability. She remembers a recent story of those pesky cyclists undertaking a horse, so to relieve her and her horse of full responsibilty she says that the horse was spooked by an undertaking cyclist. 

I would suggest that before you start recalling other posters comments, you get them in the correct context. I have nothing more to say to you as you obviously cannot get a grip with the English language.

So are we just engaging in wild conjecture without any relevance to the discussion? That’s good to know.

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Pushing50 replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
1 like

 

 

So are we just engaging in wild conjecture without any relevance to the discussion? That’s good to know.

[/quote

Yes.

conjecture
kənˈdʒɛktʃə/
noun

1.
an opinion or conclusion formed on the basis of incomplete information.
 

verb

1.
form an opinion or supposition about (something) on the basis of incomplete information.
 

synonyms: guess, speculate, surmise, infer, fancy, imagine, believe, think, suspect, presume, assume, hypothesize, take as a hypothesis, theorize, form/formulate a theory, 

Without the reporter of Horse and Hound giving any evidence of this thing actually happening (only the word of a woman named Karen) it is ALL conjecture. There is incomplete information in the report. You have come to your conclusion and others have been more sceptical and come to varying other conclusions. However the discussion took a turn for the worse when a poster queried the fact that there were no facts and was derided for it. 

If you want the last word then go for it. I am sure that this thread is long dead and to be honest I cannot be bothered to explain any more if you are unable to contemplate reasoning.

 

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Mungecrundle replied to BehindTheBikesheds | 5 years ago
1 like
BehindTheBikesheds wrote:
Mungecrundle wrote:

http://www.bhs.org.uk/our-charity/press-centre/news/regional/east-midlan... From the horse's mouth as it were. The people on the horses do apparently appreciate a call out when being approached from behind. Maybe it's like the courtesy beep debate?

I base my way of dealing with these things on how horses react to sound and movement not the riders and speaking to my partner who has ridden horses for nearly 40 years. Making noises for the benefit of the rider (surely they are making regular over the shoulder checks in any case) ignores that actually it's the horse that is the primary hazard that can cause harm.

Walk past some horses next to a fence in a field, do you start talking/making noises on approach to it, no, why because you're more likely to startle it, this is a simple fact.

Horses that are safe to use on the highway should not and in my long experience have never reacted, badly to not saying anything when coming from behind or toward. A horse that reacts badly to being passed slowly and wide (with you not saying anything) should not be hacked on the highway, it's too dangerous to the horse rider and others. As I've said, my partner took her own horse off the road because of his inability to stay calm when something like a crisp packet/plastic bag would be blown across his path or rustled when stuck in a bush.

I reckon you should write the Horse Society and point out their erroneous advice. After all what could they possibly know about horses and the best way for cyclists to interact with them, that is not trumped by your vast experience / opinion based on a partner who once owned a horse (did you ever ride it on the road?) and having passed a few yourself whilst cycling around.

Or maybe you could accept some advice from people who are in a better position to give it? Just an idea...

And that is me done for this thread*. Feel free to take a free hit.

*Except for checking on any squirel based additional comment.

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Pushing50 replied to FluffyKittenofTindalos | 5 years ago
1 like
FluffyKittenofTindalos wrote:

The thing is - what does it matter whether she is telling the truth or not?

If there is a cyclist and they are found, then they can argue the point and their guilt or innocence can be determined the same way as any other incident.  If they aren't found, then nothing happens.

 

Getting fussed about it and suggesting it's all faked, is implicitly buying into that stupid collective responsibility idea.  As if, if it _were_ someone on a bike, that would somehow reflect on everyone else who uses a bike.

 

  Even if this was a fake story (which seems unlikely to me) one day some scrote with a bike will do it for real, and there's nothing any other cyclist can do to stop it.  The ony thing one can do is be clear about how idiotic the collective responsibility idea is.

I agree with you on most things and guess what? I agree with you now. You see I do not think it matters whether she is telling the truth or not and I do not think that it matters if Karen is real or not.

I do not think that it matters if there was a cyclist or not.

I do not buy into the collective responsibility idea. I am responsible for my actions and do not excuse people who are idiots on their bikes (I would not excuse myself if I was an idiot on my bike). 

Like you I do not think that this is a fake story (although I am sceptical at the same time following the timing and the way that this has been reported).

I DO think that it matters when people are derided and ridiculed without justification and I also think that it matters that a story of this type should have no room for supposition but complete inference.

Hopefuly I have convinced myself that I have no more to say on the subject kiss

 

 

 

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don simon fbpe replied to FluffyKittenofTindalos | 5 years ago
0 likes
FluffyKittenofTindalos wrote:

The thing is - what does it matter whether she is telling the truth or not?

If there is a cyclist and they are found, then they can argue the point and their guilt or innocence can be determined the same way as any other incident.  If they aren't found, then nothing happens.

 

Getting fussed about it and suggesting it's all faked, is implicitly buying into that stupid collective responsibility idea.  As if, if it _were_ someone on a bike, that would somehow reflect on everyone else who uses a bike.

 

  Even if this was a fake story (which seems unlikely to me) one day some scrote with a bike will do it for real, and there's nothing any other cyclist can do to stop it.  The ony thing one can do is be clear about how idiotic the collective responsibility idea is.

Except it's not, is it? Having a problem with one single story cannot imply anything more than having a problem with one story.

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FluffyKittenofT... replied to don simon fbpe | 5 years ago
1 like

-nm-

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alansmurphy | 5 years ago
0 likes

"The incident happened two months after a man taking part in the Windsor Triathlon, riding in the cycling leg of the event, undertook a horse rider at speed, making contact with her as he passed"

 

I like this, thanks.

 

So there's an incident approximately every 6 months.

 

Can you do this for NMotD please, "the incident happened 3 seconds after John from Basildon was close passed, 4 seconds after Don from Wales, 5 seconds after Mansfield banned cycling..."

 

Ad infinitum!   

 

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vonhelmet replied to alansmurphy | 5 years ago
2 likes
alansmurphy wrote:

"The incident happened two months after a man taking part in the Windsor Triathlon, riding in the cycling leg of the event, undertook a horse rider at speed, making contact with her as he passed"

 

I like this, thanks.

 

So there's an incident approximately every 6 months.

 

Can you do this for NMotD please, "the incident happened 3 seconds after John from Basildon was close passed, 4 seconds after Don from Wales, 5 seconds after Mansfield banned cycling..."

 

Ad infinitum!   

 

Not sure how you’re doing your maths, or what point you think you’re making, but by all means continue.

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Crippledbiker | 5 years ago
5 likes

Just an FYI; If you see two horses being ridden abreast on a road, it will usually mean that the inside rider or horse is a novice.

Hang back, take your time. Call out, without yelling, to let the rider know you are there.

If you're part of a group of cyclists, try and pass single file. First cyclists should call "Horses Up" to get the attention of the equestrian. Never, ever ride past the horse on both sides; This will freak it the fuck out. If you're in a large group, consider spreading out a bit.

Never ride up directly behind a horse, unless you like being kicked in the face. Helmet won't help either, since it'll come from below. Oh, and no bells. Bells can startle the horse.

If there are pedestrians walking towards you on the inside of the horse - wait for them to pass.

Also, for some reason, the flag on a back of a recumbent cycle always seems to give horses the absolute screaming shits. Be aware of it.

I tend to come to an almost complete relative stop (maintain distance), call out and wait for positive affirmation from the rider that it is ok for me to pass.

I then swing very, very wide around; I've got an unusual motion, since I'm a handcyclist, and some animals dislike it.

I also try to keep talking and not pedal as I pass; I know from experience that horses do not like unexpected mechanical noises, and my voice should be just enough to drown out the clicking from the freehub.

On narrow trails where they are approaching, I pull to the side, complete stop, hands off cranks and over centre to make my intention clear.
I've had a few riders tell me that I'm ok to carry on when approaching but I usually thank them and demur; I explain that it's safest for everybody if I just wait for a moment, as they might not like the handcycle motion.

Horses are big, and they can panic with surprising ease. Controlling a panicking horse is, for many riders, nigh impossible, and they can becoming very unpredictable.

It takes a few seconds to go through the above - at worst, on a narrow trail, it might take a minute or two. Have some patience, and look out for other vulnerable road users.

IF this seems a pain in the arse, or you feel like the horse is holding you up - please make yourself known so I can slap you silly next time you complain about a close pass.

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hawkinspeter replied to Crippledbiker | 5 years ago
4 likes
Crippledbiker wrote:

... Oh, and no bells. Bells can startle the horse. If there are pedestrians walking towards you on the inside of the horse - wait for them to pass. Also, for some reason, the flag on a back of a recumbent cycle always seems to give horses the absolute screaming shits. Be aware of it....

Thanks.

I've never been too sure about whether to use a bell or not around horses and there's been some posts on this trainwreck thread recommending to use a bell. Sounds like it's best to just use your voice as all horses will be used to people speaking.

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vonhelmet | 5 years ago
4 likes

I’d take an unpredictable horse over any number of morons driving along using their phones.

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Glenn1888 | 5 years ago
1 like

Best way to advise cyclists on how to pass horses, use a cycle forum.

If you happen upon someone out for a ride on a horse, ring your bell seriously does anyone on a road bike have a bell lol, no whistle shout hello, morning/afternoon to the rider in front,pass nice and wide if a horse/rider knows your coming there shouldnt be a problem.

For those who think just a horse rider on nag/moan this is my video that was used on this site after idiots put down tacks on a steep descent in Valleys Velo 2014

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0Dx5fPTS_uU

 

I used to ride both bike and horses now just horses as due to spinal injuries I cant control my legs to cycle, be considerate stay safe the roads are for everyone.

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Crippledbiker replied to Glenn1888 | 5 years ago
1 like
Glenn1888 wrote:

I used to ride both bike and horses now just horses as due to spinal injuries I cant control my legs to cycle, be considerate stay safe the roads are for everyone.

Semi-off topic, but - Why not try a handcycle?

If it's concern about recumbents - You don't have to use that form factor, there are plenty of uprights on the market (though, naturally, they aren't nearly as quick).

I use a Team Hybrid clip-on for my commuting, and a Top End Force 2 for my leisure cycling.

Oh, and I disagree about bells - I've found that they can spook horses, though I must admit I haven't ridden a horse in well over a decade now.

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Tony Farrelly | 5 years ago
3 likes

@don simon Just a reminder that if you break the site's T&Cs with regard to personal abuse we reserve the right to delete your account without notice.
 

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Canyon48 replied to Tony Farrelly | 5 years ago
1 like
Tony Farrelly wrote:

@don simon Just a reminder that if you break the site's T&Cs with regard to personal abuse we reserve the right to delete your account without notice.
 

Chapeau, a lot of these comments are only just worthy of being on the Daily Mail website...

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Yorkshire wallet replied to Tony Farrelly | 5 years ago
5 likes
Tony Farrelly wrote:

@don simon Just a reminder that if you break the site's T&Cs with regard to personal abuse we reserve the right to delete your account without notice.
 

Maybe it's time we tried Don Simon light?

//www.yourspanishshop.es/fe-800x800-ffffff-data/productos/00118611200330____2__600x600.jpg)

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don simon fbpe replied to Tony Farrelly | 5 years ago
2 likes
Tony Farrelly wrote:

@don simon Just a reminder that if you break the site's T&Cs with regard to personal abuse we reserve the right to delete your account without notice.
 

@Tony Farrelly with all due respect, you appeared to miss out the warning to the following for unprovoked personal abuse, (plus any others I can't be arsed digging out) they abuse, I react simples. I'm sorry but calling someone stupid for being stupid, isn't an abuse and wading into a thread with personal attcks without addressing the argument is stupid. And it happens too often here.

Expatpat wrote:

If you can smell a rat its because your nose is too close to your own ass.

Don Simon's descent into oblivion should be complete following such cretinous comments.

 

Mungecrundle wrote:
don simon wrote:

I smell a rat here.I don't think that I believe there was an undertaking cyclist.

Second thing is that if a horse is so easily spooked, it shouldn't be out in public, especially on the public highway.

For any horsists dropping by to see what the cycling community think about this story, please excuse our resident moron.

If you support that, then knock yourself out, I live by my principles.

 

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joeegg | 5 years ago
2 likes

   Could it be that the undertake was actually a cyclist riding on the pavement ( if there is a pavement on this stretch of road ).

          The only thing that niggles me with the horseriders is that they never look over their shoulder to see what may be coming up behind them.I bet you could follow some for 10 minutes without them glancing behind. Last week there was an event on for horseriders over the moors close to where i live. I saw 2 riders coming down a minor road and at the junction with the main road they didn't stop or even look but just trotted out .It made it more dangerous as it was just over the brow of a hill.

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Canyon48 | 5 years ago
2 likes

Wow, this has gone wayyyyyyy over the top.

Most the comments here are very similar to those seen on local news websites when a cyclist says they have been close passed.

There are idiot cyclists out there too.

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hawkinspeter | 5 years ago
2 likes

There's certainly a lack of decent evidence here, so all we can go on is what is reported.

As far as I can tell, the horse and rider definitely exist and it seems pretty likely that she did fall off/get thrown from her horse (Polly). Now, as far as the existence of the cyclist, that's up for question as we haven't got anything except for Karen's word on that.

In lieu of any other details, I'd be inclined to take her story at face value as I can't see why  she would make something up. It could be part of a big Horse & Hound campaign against cyclists and she was paid to make up a good story to report on. It could be the result of brain trauma leading to an oddly specific hallucination. However, it's more likely it was someone on a bike who didn't know how to safely overtake a horse.

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KINGHORN | 5 years ago
0 likes

Do Audi and BMW make bicycles? God help us!

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LastBoyScout replied to KINGHORN | 5 years ago
1 like
KINGHORN wrote:

Do Audi and BMW make bicycles? God help us!

Got to love a bit of gratuitous sterotyping - good to see you could fit it in between jumping all those red lights...

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vonhelmet | 5 years ago
6 likes

So we can doubt the horse rider who saw fit to call the police over this incident, but we can’t question other posters who have no knowledge beyond what was reported, right?

I bet no one ever called the police. Karen doesn’t exist. I don’t even believe in horses. There is no Newton Road in Winwick. Horse and Hound is a front. This is a false flag incident to smear the good name of cycling.

Get a grip people.

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ChrisB200SX replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
3 likes
vonhelmet wrote:

So we can doubt the horse rider who saw fit to call the police over this incident, but we can’t question other posters who have no knowledge beyond what was reported, right?

I bet no one ever called the police. Karen doesn’t exist. I don’t even believe in horses. There is no Newton Road in Winwick. Horse and Hound is a front. This is a false flag incident to smear the good name of cycling.

Get a grip people.

I question your questioning of Don Simon's questioning of other people's lack of questioning.

I went full Inception.

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davel replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
2 likes
vonhelmet wrote:

So we can doubt the horse rider who saw fit to call the police over this incident, but we can’t question other posters who have no knowledge beyond what was reported, right?

I bet no one ever called the police. Karen doesn’t exist. I don’t even believe in horses. There is no Newton Road in Winwick. Horse and Hound is a front. This is a false flag incident to smear the good name of cycling.

Get a grip people.

Nobody is saying it *definitely* didn't happen. But 'a big boy did it and ran away' excuses happen all the time.

All the police said is that a rider was thrown from a horse. They don't mention cyclist.

This is the internet. If you don't like a drop of healthy skepticism (and that is what this is) you're going to need a helme

Taxi! 

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don simon fbpe replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
3 likes
vonhelmet wrote:

So we can doubt the horse rider who saw fit to call the police over this incident, but we can’t question other posters who have no knowledge beyond what was reported, right?

I bet no one ever called the police. Karen doesn’t exist. I don’t even believe in horses. There is no Newton Road in Winwick. Horse and Hound is a front. This is a false flag incident to smear the good name of cycling.

Get a grip people.

Feel free to question other posters who offer differing views, just don't call them a moron, or call them a moron and get it back by the bucket load. Going to an extreme to try and support an argument makes you no friends either and is quite frankly childish. There are more than one person here who'll simply stick the boot in for reasons only they know, as I said I don't particularly care.

Google Maps will show you that Newton rd Winwick does indeed exist, there is still no corroborating evidence of this cyclist.

 

Bottom line, yes, the rider can be questioned, and should be querstioned either publicly or privately until the facts are made clear. You have the same lack of facts as I do. How can you be so convinced that the fact are as stated? You can't.

//shortlist.imgix.net/app/uploads/2017/08/24232847/f54709a574e6c2e738f83cb6dcce5812-827x551.jpg?w=1200&h=1&fit=max&auto=format%2Ccompress)

Didn't really happen either.

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vonhelmet replied to don simon fbpe | 5 years ago
1 like
don simon wrote:

...just don't call them a moron...

...Google Maps will show you that Newton rd Winwick does indeed exist...

Calm down, dear. I didn’t call anyone a moron, and I know full well that Newton Road exists given I cycled down it just last week.

Is it hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse? No, not at all. Hence it seems absurd to pour scorn on the horse rider.

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don simon fbpe replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
2 likes
vonhelmet wrote:
don simon wrote:

...just don't call them a moron...

...Google Maps will show you that Newton rd Winwick does indeed exist...

Calm down, dear. I didn’t call anyone a moron, and I know full well that Newton Road exists given I cycled down it just last week.

Is it hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse? No, not at all. Hence it seems absurd to pour scorn on the horse rider.

Would you mind learning to read?
Your post talks about we being able to call into question the oppsing view. My response was to the we and a section of that group. Thanks for patronising, I'm not just calm, I'm verging on the side of enjoying this.

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davel replied to vonhelmet | 5 years ago
3 likes
vonhelmet wrote:

Is it hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse? No, not at all. Hence it seems absurd to pour scorn on the horse rider.

The scorn on here is directed at Don et al for suggesting something that runs contrary to the reported narrative. No scorn directed at the rider... Just skepticism. 

It isn't hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse at all. 

But neither is it hard to believe that a thrown rider, having called the police after the horse bolted, might blame A N Other for the spooking, particularly when no description of the cyclist is provided and the police don't even mention them.

Whichever camp you're in boils down to your own biases, and probably not even controversial, nasty biases at that. Posters having a personal pop at Don for not taking the story at face value need to have a word with themselves. 

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hawkinspeter replied to davel | 5 years ago
0 likes
davel wrote:
vonhelmet wrote:

Is it hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse? No, not at all. Hence it seems absurd to pour scorn on the horse rider.

The scorn on here is directed at Don et al for suggesting something that runs contrary to the reported narrative. No scorn directed at the rider... Just skepticism. 

It isn't hard to believe that a cyclist would undertake and scare a horse at all. 

But neither is it hard to believe that a thrown rider, having called the police after the horse bolted, might blame A N Other for the spooking, particularly when no description of the cyclist is provided and the police don't even mention them.

Whichever camp you're in boils down to your own biases, and probably not even controversial, nasty biases at that. Posters having a personal pop at Don for not taking the story at face value need to have a word with themselves. 

I don't understand why a thrown rider would find the need to blame someone for the spooking. As someone else has stated in this thread (sorry, can't remember who said it and can't be bothered to re-read it all), a horse can be spooked by crisp packets, so I just don't get why the rider couldn't just say "my horse just got spooked, I don't know why".

People having a personal pop at Don are probably just wanting to get into an argument with Don for the fun of it.

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