Strava KOMS are being hijacked by motorbikers going as fast as 112mph

majstermod wrote:

Strava could require data with power/cadence/heart monitor for all badges. If you don't have these sensors then you can use strava without KOMs. Simple and efficient.
Even if somebody rides e-bike, it will be obvious effort put into cranks was far too low for average speed achieved on segment.

I doubt that Strava care enough about fake KOMs to put the effort in. Fake KOMs are likely to get more attention from people (more page views) and Strava already have a process for people to flag rides.

Maybe either a heart or cadence sensor because you can get either for £20-30 (though the push-back would be pretty strong), but you couldn't justify requiring a power-meter - that would price too many people out of the app and from Strava's perspective probably isn't desirable.

I don't really know what the solution is - there's no easy way to prove that you're riding a bike that doesn't have a motor, at least not without a) being cripplingly expensive for Strava, or b) disuading most users from using the app. There are a few changes they could make - as other have suggested, it should auto-flag impossible rides (the app should not let you log a bicycle ride with an 150kph average speed) - but generally, they're going to have to rely on the community self-moderating.

I'm not a Strava user, but I can understand the interest (and frustration) of those who do want to benchmark their performance against their peers.

So presumably you can filter whom you compare against by age category, else it'd be pointless. How about if there were optional "data integrity" filters available, so you could further narrow the field to only those with HRM data, power data, etc, as you wish?

That way no one has to feel disenfranchised, but equally nobody else has to benchmark against improbable competitors.

That sounds a very workable solution.

majstermod wrote:

Strava could require data with power/cadence/heart monitor for all badges. If you don't have these sensors then you can use strava without KOMs. Simple and efficient.
Even if somebody rides e-bike, it will be obvious effort put into cranks was far too low for average speed achieved on segment.

I'm not sure that would work, a heart monitor would show nothing in particular without knowing what the user's resting heartbeat was, a cadence meter would be equally pointless as you could put an ebike in its lowest gear and spin the pedals at 120 rpm without resistance.

A power meter, perhaps, but even then, on many climbs on my road ebike the motor powers me up to 25 km/h then cuts, it might only cut back in as I dropped below 25 km/h on steeper pitches, so I might show power using an ebike maybe on average 50 watts below what I'd show on my unpowered road bike. Also, how do you know what someone's power/weight ratio is, a 60 kg person could put out 240W and get the same time on a KOM that would take me 320W, so you wouldn't be able to tell if they were genuine unless you had their weight, then you would be relying on users accurately to report their weight. Also, power meters are expensive and not that many people have them, it wouldn't make sense either commercially or from a fairness point of view to exclude anybody except those with power meters from the KOMs. 

Maybe there could be an "elite" KOM leaderboard for those supplying power meter and heart monitor readings, but as an overall solution I'm not sure it would work.

Rendel Harris wrote:

majstermod wrote:

Strava could require data with power/cadence/heart monitor for all badges. If you don't have these sensors then you can use strava without KOMs. Simple and efficient.
Even if somebody rides e-bike, it will be obvious effort put into cranks was far too low for average speed achieved on segment.

I'm not sure that would work, a heart monitor would show nothing in particular without knowing what the user's resting heartbeat was, a cadence meter would be equally pointless as you could put an ebike in its lowest gear and spin the pedals at 120 rpm without resistance.

A power meter, perhaps, but even then, on many climbs on my road ebike the motor powers me up to 25 km/h then cuts, it might only cut back in as I dropped below 25 km/h on steeper pitches, so I might show power using an ebike maybe on average 50 watts below what I'd show on my unpowered road bike. Also, how do you know what someone's power/weight ratio is, a 60 kg person could put out 240W and get the same time on a KOM that would take me 320W, so you wouldn't be able to tell if they were genuine unless you had their weight, then you would be relying on users accurately to report their weight. Also, power meters are expensive and not that many people have them, it wouldn't make sense either commercially or from a fairness point of view to exclude anybody except those with power meters from the KOMs. 

Maybe there could be an "elite" KOM leaderboard for those supplying power meter and heart monitor readings, but as an overall solution I'm not sure it would work.

if someone is settlng ligit records on climbs, their heart rate should be 150+, which would be unlkely on a motorbike

wycombewheeler wrote:

if someone is settlng ligit records on climbs, their heart rate should be 150+, which would be unlkely on a motorbike

Indeed, I was thinking more of ebikes though. I did an experiment a little while ago on Canonbie Road, a climb near me that averages over 11% and touches 18%. I wanted to figure out how close the exercise I got on the ebike was to the unpowered road bike, so I rode it on consecutive days in the same conditions at roughly the same speed with my HRM on; on the ebike my HR maxxed out at 159 BPM, on the road bike at 181, so were I inclined to cheat I could post the ebike ride with that data and it would look kosher.

I suppose if you were falsifying the data on a hill climb, that would be the definition of "inclined to cheat"!

Sriracha wrote:

I suppose if you were falsifying the data on a hill climb, that would be the definition of "inclined to cheat"!

I wouldn't though, once one starts that it's a slippery slope...

You always rush to take the high ground don't you!

Rendel Harris wrote:

Maybe there could be an "elite" KOM leaderboard for those supplying power meter and heart monitor readings, but as an overall solution I'm not sure it would work.

Don't give them ideas! I can picture the "elite" KOM icon, a sparkling crown in the graphical style of Candy Crush. Imagine the dopamine hit!

* Elite KOMs only available to subscribers. If you cancel your subscription, you lose all your Elite KOMs and they don't come back when you resubscribe.

Mid-motor and a Power Tap hub, or a realisation that KOMs don't actually matter.

Why should Strava care about the delicate egos of their subscribers?  If you want to compete, go ride an offical event.  All the rest's just marketing fluff.

Because if those delicate egos decide to stop subscribing then there's no more Strava.

Kapelmuur wrote:

under Manchester airport runways.

I know it well, but wouldn't flag those ones as the segment is trash. All GPS will be off in the tunnel. Anyone could have a glitch and get wild time. Meanwhile I don't thing most people are self policing the way the article suggests. I see so many people with dozens of KOMs that have been up for days, weeks, even years, and haven't been flagged. 

If you treat them more as NFTs its alot easier to ignore their significance, its digital bragging rights, held in the noise of the internet, they really dont mean a damn thing when all is said and done about it.

I thought the same thing.... and then I got one for a running segment and now I believe they are a very important training tool which can help to motivate and ensure competitive edge...

I appear to have some KOMs from when I was younger and keener as I get occasional "uh-oh..." messages.  Its annoying as I don't remember getting them, but have the agony of losing them!