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I'm no Froome... 48t? 12/13-28?

I've been searching the internet, can't seem to find any reliable parts or advice...

basically like most cyclists on a flat, I hover around 18-25 (I speak for myself)

i might get faster in time, but I have basically found that I rarely, if ever, use the smallest 2 maybe 3 cogs.

 

my main thinking was, what's the point in having a 50/11!? Especially if I can only ever use it on a long down hill. Which I have never found myself on. And I'm not racing, I'm going on a flat, or climbing, and descending while freewheeling.

has anyone seen any good options for reducing gearing at all?

 

currently running shimano 105 11 spd chainring (50/34) and 11/28 on the back.

If you're new please join in and if you have questions pop them below and the forum regulars will answer as best we can.

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14 comments

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Vejnemojnen | 6 years ago
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I'd even recommend an odd-size chainring, if possible. Ie. 49 or 51t

 

the benefit for me: the ratios are very different to that I've accustomed, and it's more comfortable to spin, rather than use brute force with odd rings. 

 

the difference between 50 and 51t is roughly 1/3th of a rear cog..  1

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CXR94Di2 | 6 years ago
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Regarding 11-32 ratios or bigger, with practice and not a great deal of it is needed. Learn to increase your cadence range. I used to cycle around 70-80 rpm but struggled with dead legs on very long rides. I spent one winter training at higher cadences. Now I happily spin at 90-100rpm, but I can with ease cycle at 75rpm upto 115rpm. Increase your range of cadence, there are many benefits.

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BehindTheBikesheds replied to CXR94Di2 | 6 years ago
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CXR94Di2 wrote:

Regarding 11-32 ratios or bigger, with practice and not a great deal of it is needed. Learn to increase your cadence range. I used to cycle around 70-80 rpm but struggled with dead legs on very long rides. I spent one winter training at higher cadences. Now I happily spin at 90-100rpm, but I can with ease cycle at 75rpm upto 115rpm. Increase your range of cadence, there are many benefits.

Evrryone has a sweet spot and if you're lugging a load or struggling up a steep incline the last thing you want is to have a relatively big but rapid change in cadence. That's the whole point of not having the big jumps in between ratios so you can maintain a rythm/cadence whatever gear you're in.
If you have a 14 starting sprocket with say a 32 low that makes the spread far easier to deal with as you transition through the lower gears which usually is at the point your riding is harder/under duress and having a regular cadence is important. Choppung and changing your cadence under duress/hard cycling because you have big jumps in the ratios is inefficient and much harder work

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Vejnemojnen | 6 years ago
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I wold not recommend a miche cassette.

 

They are actually more expensive than genuine campag or shimano ones. Albeit low-cost, their wear rate is 3-4times more rapid. Once had a cassette, and after half a season the most used cogs started to look awful-skip with a chain hardly at 0.5% wear...

 

Have been using a campag cassette since then (15k km) and it still looks in nice shape.

 

Miche cogs wear way to fast for my taste

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hoffbrandm | 6 years ago
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Yeah seems like the only viable option is spending a fair amount of money unfortunately. Ultegra, praxis chainset etc.

Since I, and especially the wife, Would like to keep my cassette and chain replacement costs to a minimum (because I've already spent our money on other components), I may see if the lbs will work me up a custom cassette with the spares they get from their distributor and see how much that costs.

or a sub compact chain set seems like a good way to go if my cassette options are limited! (I've only read bad things about miche, and I'm quite a forceful rider) and that may have to wait until the dust has settled on my fizik saddle...

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BehindTheBikesheds | 6 years ago
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I hit 34mph on a seated hard effort on a 1% decline today and was in 50-13, I actually quite like a 52 as I like mixing the tempo up.

All that said Shimano are very guilty of ignoring that most of us aren't elite riders, that tourists or those that are simply not elite riders want to use 11 speed so they can squeeze lots of ratios in between with a higher toothed sprocket as the starting point. This now particularly since Shimano abondoned triples completely for 11 speed (aside from the MTB groups).

Shimano specific cassettes with a 13t starting cog are expensive and/or hard to get, find me a Shimano 13-30, 14-30, 14 or 15 to 32. Sure Miche make them but IME are not as good shifting/hard wearing.

11-32 through to 40 or even more are garbage IMHO, the jumps in the ratios are dumb and not helpful. Now, IF one of the manufacturers offered a road spaced double crankset that could allow say down to a 28t chainring then you'd negate needing the stupidly wide cassettes we see.

I have a road spaced double that can do that (50/28 is brilliant) and indeed can be readily converted to be a triple but it's from the 1980s. Functions just as good as the newer stuff, is lighter than most of the newer cranks but doesn't really blend in with modern frames.

the praxis is okay but then you might as well just buy a 33T 110mm inner and be done, it's less than 3% difference to a 32T.  IRD I know made a 46/30 but the BCD is 94mm so it's a whole different set of chainrings. This is why the triple makes sense because you can go all the way down to a 24T ring yet still maintain the std chainrings and not have massive jumps in the ratios at the rear.

 

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700c | 6 years ago
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Yes ditch the 11 if you don't use it.

Swapping cassette is the easier and more effective option here. Go for higher range if you fancy doing steeper climbs too, or chose a tighter spacing for small increments and a good rhythm on the flat.

Im on 12-29 now and must say I don't miss my 11t with the 53. Going back to compact I'd probably miss it a bit more, but if I had to choose between slower top end speed and struggling without the 29t on a long climb, I'd prorioritise the easier cog every time.

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kil0ran | 6 years ago
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Praxis do a 48/32 chainset and FSA have something similar in 46/30. Straight swap for your 50/34 and will let you use a close ratio cassette if you're not worried about sprinter gear combos. Praxis review here http://off-road.cc/content/review/chainsets-and-chainrings/praxis-works-...

 

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StraelGuy | 6 years ago
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Having read this thread I did a bit of Googling and found that Miche do a 13-30 11 speed cassette. I'm going to try one when my current 11-28 wears out, it sounds ideal.

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ChrisB200SX | 6 years ago
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50/11 is ~35mph IIRC, which is basically down a steep descent so pedalling is not worthwhile (the velominati will disagree).

I run compact Shimano 105 11-28 and I'm pretty quick, but I still think it's overgeared for me. Shimano 105 11-28 cassette is missing a 16T, which is the gear I would be in most of the time, the jump between 15T and 17T really annoys me as the single tooth steps feel so seamless.

I'm not confident I could cope on steep hills with a 12-25 casette, I probably could, but better to have high cadence than ruin knees.

Options I've considered are hybridising a Shimano Compact and Shimano CX (46/36) chainset, so the biggest ring is a little smaller and custom-building a casette from Shimano cassette parts (this is happening), swapping 11-12-13 for 12-13 and sliding in a 16T and spacer. I'm awaiting part prices from my LBS, but it may be cheaper to just buy one of the other 105 cassette options and swap parts.
Ultegra have a casette option that is 14-28, I think. I think I'd actually want a 13T though, would need to check... and the Ultegra cassette isn't cheap, but maybe cheaper/better than two 105 cassettes.
You have to pick what the lowest gear you need will be and customise from there, I guess.

Alternative smaller chainrings are available, or look for other chainsets that are smaller, I want to keep my drivetrain looking matched though.

I may pop back here after work and post links to Shimano 105 documents so you can see the options I've considered.

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CXR94Di2 | 6 years ago
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You could go as low as 40/28t on the crank, like I do on my tourer/mountain climbing bike.  I then can use all the cass which for road use 11-32 and mountains 11-40.  These ratios allow me to climb 25% hills whilst still spinning(albeit slow speed) and ride on the flat upto 30mph.

 I use the road ratios with our club run, which is around 60 miles it involves mainly flatish roads and can keep up at 26mph with 90-95rpm.  

I only lose out on 2-3% descents where powering down the hills with bigger ratios gives more speed, any greater increase in descent gradient then gravity starts to work and freewheeling 

check out a gear claculator like BikeCalc.com, punch in the ratios you want select speed/cadence and Bob's your uncle

 

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Roadie_john | 6 years ago
2 likes

When I was road racing many years back, I trained on 48/38 x 13/23 in winter. I rode a couple of early season crits on those gears too. One of the strongest testers I know used 46/36. Reasoning was that pedal speed mattered more than brute force. I never set the world on fire with my racing speed, but I used a lot more of the cassette and pedalled mor fluently when I went back to 53/42...

Small gaps are great - modern cassettes are hard to get a good rhythm on with some big and awkward jumps.

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Vejnemojnen | 6 years ago
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I use a 14-26 cassette, I really love it. The best decision I've ever made.

 

Though I seldom use the 14t, I'm very comfortable with the small increments.

 

And I run 50-39, because I use the 39-15 and 39-16t on the flats a lot. (very good gears to have imho)

 

I'd never switch back to a cassette with 12t starter. I need gears, not storage cogs.

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madcarew | 6 years ago
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You can get a wide range of sprockets. Shimano has a 13-28 (10 sp) and I think 13-30 11sp. There are also 'novice gears' which start at 15 -25. Your suggestion is really valid, especially as you sound as if you're not an adrenaline junky trying to smash Il Falconio's downhill  strava KOM.

https://www.probikeshop.com/en/gb/miche-shimano-cassette-11v/96008.html

Good on you

Happy rides  1

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