Would you pay £3K for an aluminium Specialized Allez?

Bigfoz wrote:

I wouldn't pay £3,000 for a Specialized

So if you were offered an S-Works Tarmac SL8 Dura Ace (rrp £12,000) for three grand you'd turn it down?

Hmm, an SL8 Dura Ace for 3k is probably stolen and should thus be turned down, too.

Yep. Worst case I might (doubtful) take it at 3 and eBay it for more to get a proper bike. 

Yes, I've owned a Specialized. Yes, I've owned a[uminium. Yes, I ran Shimano for nearly 15 years. No, I don't want to return to any of them. WRT Specialized - I won't touch their products after the infamous "Roubaix" spat, worst kind of big business bullying. Aluminium just rides badly, almost as bad as cheap carbon, and has a limited service life as it becomes brittle with age and use. Shimano I found unreliable, unfixable (most components have to be replaced due to scarcity and cost of actual spare parts) and short lived (though it worked beautifully initially)

Well, I've been using various iterations of Shimano since 1985, starting with 600 (forerunner of Ultegra) and I think by now I've used everything from Claris to Dura Ace and all points in between, never had any cause for complaint - the 1985 600 was still running beautifully and needed no repairs or replacements apart from consumables (brake pads, cassette, chain and cables) when I finally sold the bike in 2002, which is not what I would call short lived.

I've had numerous Specialized bikes (six in total), I have two at present in the stable (Tricross and Roubaix Pro) and love them both. Again, I've never had one of their bikes that didn't perform up to or beyond expectations. I do think some of their offerings are overpriced. Yes they didn't cover themselves in glory over the Roubaix issue but they backed down and issued a very fulsome apology, it was over a decade ago now.

Rendel Harris wrote:

not what I would call short lived

I think some of this reputation comes from the STI levers, which - in contrast to Campag's - seem to be considered unrepairable. My first pair of Shimano STIs didn't last long but I couldn't bear to throw them away so they sat in a box for 20 years until the pandemic when I had the time (and YouTube) to figure out that they could be repaired by dislodging hardened grease by blasting WD40 into them! In contrast, I've properly dismantled and repaired a couple of Ergolevers with new spare parts (although it would have been better if their silly plastic levers hadn't broken in the first place).

There was a time when I would eagerly open up my Campag' levers to fix a problem with easily obtainable spare parts, using little more than a household toolkit.  But no more.  Too many components, if you can find someone who stocks them, are press-fit or require special tools.  I've just had two Chorus levers pack up within weeks, both ratchet mechanisms being inexplicably worn.

Meantime my six-year-old Ultegra soldiers on dutifully, benefiting from only the most cursory maintenance. 

I am reluctant to sever a lifetime's connection to the Italian brand but .........

Shimano I found unreliable, unfixable and short lived 

Apart from the inexplicably badly handled pasta cranks saga and the equally surprising failure to produce reliable power meters (neither of which affected me personally) I find the opposite. I have over 50 years experience with Shimano stuff used in the worst of conditions (excepting competitive cyclocross) and it has been very reliable and long-lived and hardly ever needs fixing

The idea that frame material matters for vibrations comes from the days of 21mm tyres pumped up to 120 psi. Nowadays with wider tyre widths and lower tyre pressures 90% of the road buzz is filtered out before it even reaches your frame material.

Matter of priorities and use.  To save cash, I'd ditch the electronic shifting, get myself a 105-equipped Triban at half the price and be done with it.   Had I done that, the cash returns from -in my case- my cycling to work scheme would have seen me break even in 7 months and actually gain cash from riding a bike after.  Now THAT would be a first.  But since I went with Ti and electronic shifting, break even was pushed to 3 years   if nothing expensive breaks, that is.

I also used to drink the kool-ade about alloy frames feeling harsh or dead and while material properties mean that those frames do start with an inherent disadvantage, a well-designed alloy frame will easily beat cheap carbon or shoddily made steel. 

Zjtm231 wrote:

3k you must be joking?! 105 disc groupset is not about £550, hunt wheels £300...so will they want over 2k for frame saddle and bars. Hilarious pricing

I'm interested in where one can get a 105 Di2 groupset for £550...

yeah, cheapest you can get it at the minute is £1k.

Saw Di2 105 for around that price during Black Friday.

It's an interesting point you raise.

Whilst Di2 will set you back £1k, not £550, add up similar wheels around £400, and decent finishing kit at £350, you are actually looking around £1350 for the frameset, including forks headset and seatpost. That's kind of where I'd expect top end alloy to be. 

You can buy the Allez Sprint Frameset - RRP £1,500. 

Can't compare 105 with Ultegra electronic shifting but in the SRAM universe I've ridden wireless from Rival via Force to Red and by and large I concur. 

You lose some weight, gain some comfort (incrementally smoother shifting) and what I'd call 'comfort features' (fluid damping, cage lock) as you go up but by and large, what you gain certainly doesn't compensate for the huge price difference.

Only people for whom it might make a difference are pros, and they don't buy their own kit so....

And in turn those with Ultegra Di2 question the need for Dura Ace...